s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 1 I was eb2 and I got green card already. However, I don't understand why
every eb2 are so enthusiastic about HR3012. It seems that the USCIS was
already trying to better utilize the spillover visa number and we saw the
number of approval in the past a few months rising dramatically so I don't
think they are enforcing the 7% rule anyway. So what is the possible gain
from HR3012? To get some visa number from ROW? I believe the gain is very
limited and the risk is that our visa number would be robbed by Indian. |
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 2 嗯，反对吧，反对吧。说的挺好的，再多说点呗。比如说，怕后面的人拿绿卡太快影响了工作啥
的？
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: I was eb2 and I got green card already. However, I don't understand why
: every eb2 are so enthusiastic about HR3012. It seems that the USCIS was
: already trying to better utilize the spillover visa number and we saw the
: number of approval in the past a few months rising dramatically so I don't
: think they are enforcing the 7% rule anyway. So what is the possible gain
: from HR3012? To get some visa number from ROW? I believe the gain is very
: limited and the risk is that our visa number would be robbed by Indian.
|
j*e
发帖数: 1987 | 3 3012前 EB-2 C&I 捆绑， EB-2ROW All C,
3012后 EB-2 全世界一起捆绑
you figure it out yourself |
N*******r
发帖数: 1098 | 4 FIFO is more reasonable than birthplace quota which I believe is
discriminaion.
Should the queue be FIFO? |
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 5 没交485的eb2反对3012，可以理解为智商问题。拿了绿卡的反对3012绝对是道德问题。
【在 j*e 的大作中提到】
: 3012前 EB-2 C&I 捆绑， EB-2ROW All C,
: 3012后 EB-2 全世界一起捆绑
: you figure it out yourself
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 6 I just believe that chinese EB don't have much to gain from 3012. We are
getting spillover already, right?
【在 c*********n 的大作中提到】
: 没交485的eb2反对3012，可以理解为智商问题。拿了绿卡的反对3012绝对是道德问题。
|
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 7 如果是不了解情况，有这个疑问倒是可以理解。如果你拿绿卡的时间不长，那你还记得
2年前印度人拿了近万个SO，韩国人拿走了千多个SO，中国人拿走了200个SO的美好回忆
么？
在现有制度下，谁能够真正保证些什么？在3012的基础上，抢劫ROW有什么不对的？印度人多了你
担心，ROW多了你就坦然了？
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: I just believe that chinese EB don't have much to gain from 3012. We are
: getting spillover already, right?
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 8 well, do you think it will change when hr3012 pass?
Korean may lost that thousand of SO, how many will land to china? how much
more could be robbed by indian if we don't have 7% reserved visa number?
The previous way of SO allocation (based on PD) is exactly what HR3012 gives
us. Only difference is that we have our garanteed 7%.
I will be all for the increase of per-country limit for EB from 7% to 14%.
Why can't it follow the FB change which is proposed in the bill anyway. That
is even less change of the existing bill.
【在 c*********n 的大作中提到】
: 如果是不了解情况，有这个疑问倒是可以理解。如果你拿绿卡的时间不长，那你还记得
: 2年前印度人拿了近万个SO，韩国人拿走了千多个SO，中国人拿走了200个SO的美好回忆
: 么？
: 在现有制度下，谁能够真正保证些什么？在3012的基础上，抢劫ROW有什么不对的？印度人多了你
: 担心，ROW多了你就坦然了？
|
j****n
发帖数: 191 | 9 Gurantee 7%? Are you kidding? 7% is the limit and there is no gurantee on
that. |
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 10 oh, really?
I thought it is the way how the PD is moving month to month before. They
break down EB2C's quota into each month.
【在 j****n 的大作中提到】
: Gurantee 7%? Are you kidding? 7% is the limit and there is no gurantee on
: that.
|
|
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 11 If we can't get 7% before, how can HR3012 help us secure the visa number
from ROW?
【在 j****n 的大作中提到】
: Gurantee 7%? Are you kidding? 7% is the limit and there is no gurantee on
: that.
|
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 12 3012如果通过，名额分配会是什么情况这里已经讨论多少次了，我就不重复了。如果想
找权威的说法，那就去看看老猪的帖子。
印度人发起的法案，难道还指望他们以帮老中为目的么？他们为自己争取到利益，老中
能够跟着受益，这就已经很不错了，还能要求些什么呢？难道就是因为印度人受益多，
就去反对？
7%到14%当然好，谁去推动？谁有力量去推动？
much
gives
That
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: well, do you think it will change when hr3012 pass?
: Korean may lost that thousand of SO, how many will land to china? how much
: more could be robbed by indian if we don't have 7% reserved visa number?
: The previous way of SO allocation (based on PD) is exactly what HR3012 gives
: us. Only difference is that we have our garanteed 7%.
: I will be all for the increase of per-country limit for EB from 7% to 14%.
: Why can't it follow the FB change which is proposed in the bill anyway. That
: is even less change of the existing bill.
|
g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 13 I don't think EB2 India/China tie will change in the next 5 years if
nothing is changed. 3012 take ROW to the same boat and it's at least
fair.
I wouldn't wait for 2 extra years, get way more EB2ROWs green in
order to slow down fewer EB2I. Only mentally retarded would do that.
much
gives
That
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: well, do you think it will change when hr3012 pass?
: Korean may lost that thousand of SO, how many will land to china? how much
: more could be robbed by indian if we don't have 7% reserved visa number?
: The previous way of SO allocation (based on PD) is exactly what HR3012 gives
: us. Only difference is that we have our garanteed 7%.
: I will be all for the increase of per-country limit for EB from 7% to 14%.
: Why can't it follow the FB change which is proposed in the bill anyway. That
: is even less change of the existing bill.
|
g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 14 Because it's FIFO, I don't understand why people are against a change
before they read what the change is.
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: If we can't get 7% before, how can HR3012 help us secure the visa number
: from ROW?
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 15
That is what I don't understand. India and China have their seperate PD, so
why it is justified to tie India/China together?
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: I don't think EB2 India/China tie will change in the next 5 years if
: nothing is changed. 3012 take ROW to the same boat and it's at least
: fair.
: I wouldn't wait for 2 extra years, get way more EB2ROWs green in
: order to slow down fewer EB2I. Only mentally retarded would do that.
:
: much
: gives
: That
|
g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 16 Because they both have more than 7% or 2800 demand every year.
And O decides to FIFO for those countries. He gets the least
criticism doing it this way (FYI, bash on mitbbs doesn't count).
so
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
:
: That is what I don't understand. India and China have their seperate PD, so
: why it is justified to tie India/China together?
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 17 If India and China were not tied together, India's PD should be a few years
earlier than us. In that scenario, do you agree FIFO?
FIFO (or EB2I tied with EB2C) were argument used by O which redirect the
spillover to EB23I. I don't think any of us agree with that before.
Obviously, HR3012 are Indian's idea to boost their share (why the upper
limit for the top two country is 85%? not 60%?). Why can't they have some
upper limit a single country can get after the 3 year transitional period?
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: Because it's FIFO, I don't understand why people are against a change
: before they read what the change is.
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 18 Reserve 7% for both country and then FIFO? or FIFO from the beginning?
【在 g*****g 的大作中提到】
: Because they both have more than 7% or 2800 demand every year.
: And O decides to FIFO for those countries. He gets the least
: criticism doing it this way (FYI, bash on mitbbs doesn't count).
:
: so
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 19 What you say is exactly I hate.
Right, we don't try to fight for our share but just wait for others leftover.
If we have the power to prevent 3012's passing, we can use that as leverage
to amend the law from 7% to 14%. India would benefit from that law change
as well.
【在 c*********n 的大作中提到】
: 3012如果通过，名额分配会是什么情况这里已经讨论多少次了，我就不重复了。如果想
: 找权威的说法，那就去看看老猪的帖子。
: 印度人发起的法案，难道还指望他们以帮老中为目的么？他们为自己争取到利益，老中
: 能够跟着受益，这就已经很不错了，还能要求些什么呢？难道就是因为印度人受益多，
: 就去反对？
: 7%到14%当然好，谁去推动？谁有力量去推动？
:
: much
: gives
: That
|
g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 20 FIFO and make sure both countries get at least 7%.
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: Reserve 7% for both country and then FIFO? or FIFO from the beginning?
|
|
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 21 Actually, how about make sure the 27% rule is enforced and just amend the
bill to regulate the spillover visa number allocation like in HR3012? Like,
no single country can get more than 70% of the spillover. Which will
remove the tie between EB2I and EB2C.
leftover.
leverage
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: What you say is exactly I hate.
: Right, we don't try to fight for our share but just wait for others leftover.
: If we have the power to prevent 3012's passing, we can use that as leverage
: to amend the law from 7% to 14%. India would benefit from that law change
: as well.
|
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 22 LLLLLLOOOOOOLLLLLLL
" we don't try to fight for our share but just wait for others leftover",不
知道应该说你很傻很天真还是随便张嘴就来这么一句。谁去办这件事情？怎么办这件事
情？凭什么去办？就凭一张嘴么？
LIA,NIU都在看着这个法案，有什么具体实施办法或者对策让老中拿到更多利益么？没
有。。。。。你一个人怎么去抗争？在这点上，老猪这样的英雄太可贵了。
如果只是一张嘴张开就说，而且是拿到绿卡站着说话不腰疼的情况下说，我不表示任何
感激和赞赏。
leftover.
leverage
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: What you say is exactly I hate.
: Right, we don't try to fight for our share but just wait for others leftover.
: If we have the power to prevent 3012's passing, we can use that as leverage
: to amend the law from 7% to 14%. India would benefit from that law change
: as well.
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 23 I am suggesting LIA and NIU to talk to those India backers to verbally
oppose this bill. (we don't have to put much effort in that). The worst
thing is they don't take us seriously and the bill still passes. We still
gain our share. But if this bill is not passed in the end, then they might
want to hear our voice the next time when they propose similiar bill.
【在 c*********n 的大作中提到】
: LLLLLLOOOOOOLLLLLLL
: " we don't try to fight for our share but just wait for others leftover",不
: 知道应该说你很傻很天真还是随便张嘴就来这么一句。谁去办这件事情？怎么办这件事
: 情？凭什么去办？就凭一张嘴么？
: LIA,NIU都在看着这个法案，有什么具体实施办法或者对策让老中拿到更多利益么？没
: 有。。。。。你一个人怎么去抗争？在这点上，老猪这样的英雄太可贵了。
: 如果只是一张嘴张开就说，而且是拿到绿卡站着说话不腰疼的情况下说，我不表示任何
: 感激和赞赏。
:
: leftover.
|
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 24 这个建议很好，那么，with all my respect,请问你能够为这件事情做些什么？除了建
议以外。
might
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: I am suggesting LIA and NIU to talk to those India backers to verbally
: oppose this bill. (we don't have to put much effort in that). The worst
: thing is they don't take us seriously and the bill still passes. We still
: gain our share. But if this bill is not passed in the end, then they might
: want to hear our voice the next time when they propose similiar bill.
|
s*****c
发帖数: 753 | 25 If LIA and NIU also think 这个建议很好, and willing to act. Then I would
act according to their command, like calling/writing to congressman.
【在 c*********n 的大作中提到】
: 这个建议很好，那么，with all my respect,请问你能够为这件事情做些什么？除了建
: 议以外。
:
: might
|
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 26 Right, I will do the same. And, what are we waiting for now?
【在 s*****c 的大作中提到】
: If LIA and NIU also think 这个建议很好, and willing to act. Then I would
: act according to their command, like calling/writing to congressman.
|
S*******r
发帖数: 11017 | 27 No one has a clear explanation of the current "green wave". Maybe O is
making up for his mistake not moving VB to 2008 over the past summer; maybe
O is implementing 27% rule under the pressure; or maybe he is just trying to
clean up the July 2007 fiasco to create inventory. Whether or not EB2C has
got more than 2803 for the last two months is still a question that no one
has affirmative answers yet, nor can anyone--including O to guarantee that
such a green wave can happen to EB2C every year going forward. Remember,
2007 Fiasco is a once in a blue moon thing. So please stop claiming that
EB2C will be fine under the current rules. |
m********r
发帖数: 2895 | 28 Re
自己拿到绿卡以后再号召其他人延长自己等待来跟老印斗争，这是柴玲的风格，得有一定的脸皮才做得出来这样的事情。
怎么不干脆建议美国以后不要批绿卡了，这样压根儿没有老印跟你来争那点IT的工作不是更好？
【在 c*********n 的大作中提到】
: LLLLLLOOOOOOLLLLLLL
: " we don't try to fight for our share but just wait for others leftover",不
: 知道应该说你很傻很天真还是随便张嘴就来这么一句。谁去办这件事情？怎么办这件事
: 情？凭什么去办？就凭一张嘴么？
: LIA,NIU都在看着这个法案，有什么具体实施办法或者对策让老中拿到更多利益么？没
: 有。。。。。你一个人怎么去抗争？在这点上，老猪这样的英雄太可贵了。
: 如果只是一张嘴张开就说，而且是拿到绿卡站着说话不腰疼的情况下说，我不表示任何
: 感激和赞赏。
:
: leftover.
|
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 29 柴大妈的公司不知道怎么样了，如果还不错的话，Springc的这种看法倒是的确很符合
柴大妈当前的利益。
一定的脸皮才做得出来这样的事情。
不是更好？
【在 m********r 的大作中提到】
: Re
: 自己拿到绿卡以后再号召其他人延长自己等待来跟老印斗争，这是柴玲的风格，得有一定的脸皮才做得出来这样的事情。
: 怎么不干脆建议美国以后不要批绿卡了，这样压根儿没有老印跟你来争那点IT的工作不是更好？
|
o********s
发帖数: 971 | |
|
|
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 31 过河以后，大声呼吁还在河对面的老中不要为了自己的利好而放弃和烙印作斗争的，是
远虑还是近忧呢？
【在 o********s 的大作中提到】
: 人无远虑，必有近忧。
|
a***g
发帖数: 2402 | 32 如果没理解错的话，你是说支持3012的人没有远虑吧？
我可不这么看。真正的远虑是什么？我个人认为美国的墨西哥化才是让广大技术移民们
忧虑的事情。3012通过，近期可以抵消非法移民合法化的压力，远景可以唤起来自大多
数国家的合法移民们对移民改革的诉求，从而最大化合法移民的利益，进一步削弱非法
移民的势力。这难道不是大家所喜闻乐见的吗？
【在 o********s 的大作中提到】
: 人无远虑，必有近忧。
|
l****i
发帖数: 3339 | 33 你应该着手反对老中办绿卡了
nnd 居然有这么不要脸的 |
o********s
发帖数: 971 | 34 我认为墨西哥和中国/印度不在一个市场上竞争。
我认为中国和印度在很多领域上是重合的，竞争很严重，而且会更激烈。
我认为中国和印度是未来100年的冤家对头。
我认为印度可能成为中国的苦手，因为语言和文化的缘故更容易被西方接受。
所以，我认为抵制印度应该从全方位着手。 |
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 35 很多人的远虑和近忧只包括可能增多的烙印和老中导致绿卡贬值，从而可能给自己带来
的潜在问题。所以在自己进门之后，门关的越严越好。不要说劳模的问题，就是ROW的
那些直接Current的绿卡，对他们来说可以直接忽视，既不是远虑，也不是近忧，都是
“关我屁事”的问题。
【在 a***g 的大作中提到】
: 如果没理解错的话，你是说支持3012的人没有远虑吧？
: 我可不这么看。真正的远虑是什么？我个人认为美国的墨西哥化才是让广大技术移民们
: 忧虑的事情。3012通过，近期可以抵消非法移民合法化的压力，远景可以唤起来自大多
: 数国家的合法移民们对移民改革的诉求，从而最大化合法移民的利益，进一步削弱非法
: 移民的势力。这难道不是大家所喜闻乐见的吗？
|
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 36 赞民族大义！！！
锅里有多少吃的东西咱不管，但自己宁肯饿着，碗里这几粒花生豆也绝对不能让印度人
吃掉太多了。。。。。你以为我在开玩笑么？那可都是花生豆啊，吃了以后整个民族在
碗里的势力就瞬间强大了。。。。
锅里呢？锅里关我屁事。。。。。
【在 o********s 的大作中提到】
: 我认为墨西哥和中国/印度不在一个市场上竞争。
: 我认为中国和印度在很多领域上是重合的，竞争很严重，而且会更激烈。
: 我认为中国和印度是未来100年的冤家对头。
: 我认为印度可能成为中国的苦手，因为语言和文化的缘故更容易被西方接受。
: 所以，我认为抵制印度应该从全方位着手。
|
S*******r
发帖数: 11017 | 37 抵制老印就好比叫嚣着抵制MADE IN CHINA产品一样
一无必要
二无可能
【在 o********s 的大作中提到】
: 我认为墨西哥和中国/印度不在一个市场上竞争。
: 我认为中国和印度在很多领域上是重合的，竞争很严重，而且会更激烈。
: 我认为中国和印度是未来100年的冤家对头。
: 我认为印度可能成为中国的苦手，因为语言和文化的缘故更容易被西方接受。
: 所以，我认为抵制印度应该从全方位着手。
|
S*******r
发帖数: 11017 | 38 有时候真不知道这些民族大义从哪里来的
实在找不到摆得上台面的反对理由可以明说
我宁可看到有人说“我花5年时间绿了 后来人只要2年时间绿 我很不爽”
这样的人还真诚一点
【在 c*********n 的大作中提到】
: 赞民族大义！！！
: 锅里有多少吃的东西咱不管，但自己宁肯饿着，碗里这几粒花生豆也绝对不能让印度人
: 吃掉太多了。。。。。你以为我在开玩笑么？那可都是花生豆啊，吃了以后整个民族在
: 碗里的势力就瞬间强大了。。。。
: 锅里呢？锅里关我屁事。。。。。
|
o********s
发帖数: 971 | 39 我不想证明你是错的。
我认为你说的在你个人立场上来说是有道理的。
我认为那些“违心“申请政治庇护绿卡的在他们的个人立场上说是有道理的。
我甚至认为那些做假鸡蛋，卖地沟油的在他们的个人立场上说是有一定道理的。
我只能说道不同不相为谋。 |
a***g
发帖数: 2402 | 40 你真应该好好琢磨琢磨什么叫人无远虑了。现在表面看来墨西哥人和中国人的工作市场
没有多大重合，但你不要忘记，随着墨西哥人的增加，那帮政客为了选票只会不断的修
改政令让各种利益向墨西哥系倾斜，到那个时候我们中国人的利益还会有人考虑吗？这
才是最可怕的。
【在 o********s 的大作中提到】
: 我认为墨西哥和中国/印度不在一个市场上竞争。
: 我认为中国和印度在很多领域上是重合的，竞争很严重，而且会更激烈。
: 我认为中国和印度是未来100年的冤家对头。
: 我认为印度可能成为中国的苦手，因为语言和文化的缘故更容易被西方接受。
: 所以，我认为抵制印度应该从全方位着手。
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c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 41 开始抬杠了不是？咱怎么又不谈远虑的问题了？
【在 o********s 的大作中提到】
: 我不想证明你是错的。
: 我认为你说的在你个人立场上来说是有道理的。
: 我认为那些“违心“申请政治庇护绿卡的在他们的个人立场上说是有道理的。
: 我甚至认为那些做假鸡蛋，卖地沟油的在他们的个人立场上说是有一定道理的。
: 我只能说道不同不相为谋。
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a***g
发帖数: 2402 | 42 咱还是别把人往坏处想吧，反对3012的人们可能也是好意。
不过，说来说去，最大化合法移民的利益才是最终目标，美国如果真成了非法移民的天
堂，那有没有绿卡也就真没什么意思了。
【在 c*********n 的大作中提到】
: 很多人的远虑和近忧只包括可能增多的烙印和老中导致绿卡贬值，从而可能给自己带来
: 的潜在问题。所以在自己进门之后，门关的越严越好。不要说劳模的问题，就是ROW的
: 那些直接Current的绿卡，对他们来说可以直接忽视，既不是远虑，也不是近忧，都是
: “关我屁事”的问题。
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y**********r
发帖数: 2004 | |
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 44 Keep Your Friends Close. Keep Your Enemies Closer
这句话其实用在中印关系上再合适不过了。中印之间的直接竞争非常激烈，看似不可调
和，其实在更大范围内，是天然的合作关系。
【在 a***g 的大作中提到】
: 你真应该好好琢磨琢磨什么叫人无远虑了。现在表面看来墨西哥人和中国人的工作市场
: 没有多大重合，但你不要忘记，随着墨西哥人的增加，那帮政客为了选票只会不断的修
: 改政令让各种利益向墨西哥系倾斜，到那个时候我们中国人的利益还会有人考虑吗？这
: 才是最可怕的。
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o********s
发帖数: 971 | 45 "看似不可调和，其实在更大范围内，是天然的合作关系"
这个是纯粹新闻联播论调，如果摘自人民日报请注明转载。
also, i feel you didn't understand the difference between close and closer.
you MIGHT need to put more thoughts on this. |
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 46 不想着怎么把饼做大，只想着怎么把别人踩下去，你觉得到底是什么样的人更需要“
put more thoughts on this”。
.
【在 o********s 的大作中提到】
: "看似不可调和，其实在更大范围内，是天然的合作关系"
: 这个是纯粹新闻联播论调，如果摘自人民日报请注明转载。
: also, i feel you didn't understand the difference between close and closer.
: you MIGHT need to put more thoughts on this.
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o********s
发帖数: 971 | 47 问题是，
1。我们需要这么大的饼么？我的结论是我们的胃口现在看上去不错，但是数据证明在
变小，而且胃口越来越小。
2。我觉得3012只能使小部分人更快的吃到饼。就是已经在排队的eb2cs.
my impression is, you need gc very badly. (i might be wrong on this because
i don't know you.)
but, it will be great if you can convince me that eb2/3, as a group, needs
this 3012 in the short and the long run.
end. |
c*********n
发帖数: 1371 | 48 现在留学生人数不能说井喷，也是直线增长，何来胃口小之说？即使胃口小了，就宁愿
把绿卡给ROW，也不愿意和烙印一起沾光？为什么只盯着烙印，对ROW毫无道理的C就视
而不见呢？
关于受益的群体问题，我已经说过了一百遍啊一百遍。。。。。。你要是还不信，老猪
的话对你可能会有点帮助：
http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t/EB23/31466023.html
要说08，09以后的EB3C,我也说过了，现在的制度只有一个结果：死。
有些变革难道比死更可怕么？
because
【在 o********s 的大作中提到】
: 问题是，
: 1。我们需要这么大的饼么？我的结论是我们的胃口现在看上去不错，但是数据证明在
: 变小，而且胃口越来越小。
: 2。我觉得3012只能使小部分人更快的吃到饼。就是已经在排队的eb2cs.
: my impression is, you need gc very badly. (i might be wrong on this because
: i don't know you.)
: but, it will be great if you can convince me that eb2/3, as a group, needs
: this 3012 in the short and the long run.
: end.
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q****x
发帖数: 7404 | 49 自己先把绿卡拿到手再说。管的多。
【在 a***g 的大作中提到】
: 咱还是别把人往坏处想吧，反对3012的人们可能也是好意。
: 不过，说来说去，最大化合法移民的利益才是最终目标，美国如果真成了非法移民的天
: 堂，那有没有绿卡也就真没什么意思了。
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S******y
发帖数: 1330 | 50 首先声明我不反对3012，没交485呢
但是上纲上线有意思吗？道德问题的帽子都出来了。就不允许不同意见？ |
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N*******r
发帖数: 1098 | 51 都是皇帝不急，太监急。
美国必然拉丁化。烙印和老中在这儿只是想有个好的生活。也都不是，也不会是主流。
也谈不上什么冲突或是大的竞争。 |
