Z**L
发帖数: 1101 | 1 版上很多人说ford edge的AWD很弱，有什么具体依据吗？
另外在费城开车的话，同样的预算，买森林人还是edge？谢谢！ |
u****q
发帖数: 24345 | |
r*****j
发帖数: 7481 | 3 谁说Forester的好？
肯定Edge好啊，不信你问@laoselang |
l*******g
发帖数: 27064 | 4 以前的subaru四驱在菜车里面是最牛逼的
不过现在么，被丰田控股以后开始学习丰田的偷工减料技术
四驱早就缩水了，加上cvt变速箱
forester低配实际表现连escape都不如，顶多打个平手
edge虽然不是为越野设计的，但是那个inteli awd系统还是挺好的，看过一个视频，
edge跟着帕拉丁off road，有时候轮子悬空竟然不空转，这一点subaru是办不到的
我觉得应付一般冰雪路面问题不大，尤其换雪胎的话肯定就更没问题了
如果两个价格差不多，肯定edge更划算，毕竟高一个级别
不过edge的自动跟车系统确实不如subaru的eyesight，如果你对这个有需求那就没得选了
本版丰田托很多，所以还是自己决定吧，别被田托忽悠瘸了 |
h*******7
发帖数: 553 | 5 我印象中forester不是CVT吧？这个级别好像只有crv和rogue?
“forester低配表现连escape都不如” 这个说法有根据吗？我挺喜欢forester的四驱
有些车比如crv Rav4 rogue CX5在我们这买不到二驱 dealer们鼓吹四驱多好多好 我心
想四驱就直接上forester了 来你们这干啥
选了
【在 l*******g 的大作中提到】
: 以前的subaru四驱在菜车里面是最牛逼的
: 不过现在么，被丰田控股以后开始学习丰田的偷工减料技术
: 四驱早就缩水了，加上cvt变速箱
: forester低配实际表现连escape都不如，顶多打个平手
: edge虽然不是为越野设计的，但是那个inteli awd系统还是挺好的，看过一个视频，
: edge跟着帕拉丁off road，有时候轮子悬空竟然不空转，这一点subaru是办不到的
: 我觉得应付一般冰雪路面问题不大，尤其换雪胎的话肯定就更没问题了
: 如果两个价格差不多，肯定edge更划算，毕竟高一个级别
: 不过edge的自动跟车系统确实不如subaru的eyesight，如果你对这个有需求那就没得选了
: 本版丰田托很多，所以还是自己决定吧，别被田托忽悠瘸了
|
B*Z
发帖数: 7062 | 6 老色狼的话你听听就行了。Sbuaru的awd虽然比以前缩水了，但是还是全时60：40分配
的full time awd。结构基本类似bmw的xdrive。当然比escape的好了。colorado这样的
地方subaru销量特别大，不是没有原因的。
驱
【在 h*******7 的大作中提到】
: 我印象中forester不是CVT吧？这个级别好像只有crv和rogue?
: “forester低配表现连escape都不如” 这个说法有根据吗？我挺喜欢forester的四驱
: 有些车比如crv Rav4 rogue CX5在我们这买不到二驱 dealer们鼓吹四驱多好多好 我心
: 想四驱就直接上forester了 来你们这干啥
:
: 选了
|
m********s
发帖数: 55301 | 7 拿销量来说明好还是不好？
老色狼看了一眼自己从carmax买的三手mini，继续向大家高喊，福特好，福特新车更安
全，哪怕同级别的福特新车比carmax的三手mini的价格低很多，也是福特好。
最注重安全、新车砍价专家的老色狼去carmax买价格更贵而且还是三手的mini，而不买
他自己最推崇更安全、新车价格还低的福特，脑子估计全是屎啊。
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 老色狼的话你听听就行了。Sbuaru的awd虽然比以前缩水了，但是还是全时60：40分配
: 的full time awd。结构基本类似bmw的xdrive。当然比escape的好了。colorado这样的
: 地方subaru销量特别大，不是没有原因的。
:
: 驱
|
h*******7
发帖数: 553 | 8 60:40指的是前轮60后轮40吗？
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 老色狼的话你听听就行了。Sbuaru的awd虽然比以前缩水了，但是还是全时60：40分配
: 的full time awd。结构基本类似bmw的xdrive。当然比escape的好了。colorado这样的
: 地方subaru销量特别大，不是没有原因的。
:
: 驱
|
Y****a
发帖数: 17170 | 9
Yes. 宝马正好是反过来的。
【在 h*******7 的大作中提到】
: 60:40指的是前轮60后轮40吗？
|
Y****a
发帖数: 17170 | 10
你应该感谢老色狼，如果不是老色狼不停的提起subaru的话，
车迷版讨论的结果，也没有人没事干在这里科普。
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 老色狼的话你听听就行了。Sbuaru的awd虽然比以前缩水了，但是还是全时60：40分配
: 的full time awd。结构基本类似bmw的xdrive。当然比escape的好了。colorado这样的
: 地方subaru销量特别大，不是没有原因的。
:
: 驱
|
|
|
Y****a
发帖数: 17170 | 11
福特英文论坛上满屏满屏抱怨transimssion的情况都被老色狼的数据给忽略了，因为那
些抱怨的人都是丰田花钱请去的。嘿嘿
【在 m********s 的大作中提到】
: 拿销量来说明好还是不好？
: 老色狼看了一眼自己从carmax买的三手mini，继续向大家高喊，福特好，福特新车更安
: 全，哪怕同级别的福特新车比carmax的三手mini的价格低很多，也是福特好。
: 最注重安全、新车砍价专家的老色狼去carmax买价格更贵而且还是三手的mini，而不买
: 他自己最推崇更安全、新车价格还低的福特，脑子估计全是屎啊。
|
s**********u
发帖数: 2749 | 12 是CVT，这个比较不爽。
驱
【在 h*******7 的大作中提到】
: 我印象中forester不是CVT吧？这个级别好像只有crv和rogue?
: “forester低配表现连escape都不如” 这个说法有根据吗？我挺喜欢forester的四驱
: 有些车比如crv Rav4 rogue CX5在我们这买不到二驱 dealer们鼓吹四驱多好多好 我心
: 想四驱就直接上forester了 来你们这干啥
:
: 选了
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 13 为什么Subaru的awd虽然比以前缩水了?
目前我知道的新旧版forester 4EAT AWD的区别
老版(08年前)全时80：20分配(又有说法是90:10), 新版(09年后)全时60：40分配
老版(08年前)后轴用LSD, 但是是最弱的viscous LSD. 新版(09年后)用VDC代替, 14年
版加了xmode. 就是VDC on steroid
老版(08年前)的rear differential的size明显比09年后的小一圈
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 老色狼的话你听听就行了。Sbuaru的awd虽然比以前缩水了，但是还是全时60：40分配
: 的full time awd。结构基本类似bmw的xdrive。当然比escape的好了。colorado这样的
: 地方subaru销量特别大，不是没有原因的。
:
: 驱
|
f****t
发帖数: 15913 | 14 俺2001年的outback基本配置有LSD、六碟音响和金钢不坏的4AT，新款基本配置有这些
吗?
【在 e**n 的大作中提到】
: 为什么Subaru的awd虽然比以前缩水了?
: 目前我知道的新旧版forester 4EAT AWD的区别
: 老版(08年前)全时80：20分配(又有说法是90:10), 新版(09年后)全时60：40分配
: 老版(08年前)后轴用LSD, 但是是最弱的viscous LSD. 新版(09年后)用VDC代替, 14年
: 版加了xmode. 就是VDC on steroid
: 老版(08年前)的rear differential的size明显比09年后的小一圈
|
B*Z
发帖数: 7062 | 15 主要说的是中央差速器。这个是网上一个文章。附件是现在的subaru中央差速器分类。
There is a lot of confusion about the differences between the various Subaru
AWD systems:
? Continuous (for 5MT)
? Active (for 4EAT)
? VTD (for 5EAT)
? availability or non-availability of Rear LSD
So heres an attempt to explain the differences....
1. Continuous AWD System:
The manual transmission’s all-wheel drive is referred to as a continuous al
l-wheel drive system. It uses a center differential located inside the trans
mission case that is controlled by a viscous coupling device. In effect, the
center differential is a limited-slip differential.
In normal operation, power is distributed equally to the front and rear whee
ls. Plates are alternately attached to the front and rear output shafts insi
de the viscous coupling. When a rotational difference occurs between the fro
nt and back wheels, the plates inside the viscous housing shear inside the c
ontained fluid (a type of silicone) heating it and causing the fluid to thic
ken. The thickened fluid causes the plates to transfer torque from those tha
t rotate faster (the slipping wheels) to the plates that rotate slower (the
wheels with the best traction).
This no-maintenance system is simple, compact and virtually invisible in its
operation. The system can distribute torque from a 50:50 torque split for m
aximum traction to mostly front or rear wheel drive.
(Source: http://www.autoworld.com/news/Subaru..._All-Wheel.htm)
A. Continuous AWD with Rear LSD: Available with 5MT on WRX, Legacy GT, Outba
ck 2.5i, Outback XT and with 6MT on Spec.B
B. Continuous AWD without rear LSD: Available with 5MT on Impreza 2.5i, Outb
ack Sport and Legacy 2.5i
2. Active AWD System:
Active all-wheel drive is a term coined by Subaru to differentiate the all-w
heel drive system in the automatic transmission (4EAT) from other "reactive"
all-wheel drive systems on the market today. What makes this all-wheel driv
e system so special is its ability to anticipate traction needs and act befo
re a wheel slips.
The mechanism that transfers torque fore and aft is contained within the tra
nsmission’s tailshaft. To the casual observer it looks just like a typical
hydraulic clutch found in any automatic. The key difference in this clutch p
ack is its operation. It’s designed to slip according to how much all-wheel
drive is needed. When an automatic’s clutch slips, it is due to a malfunct
ion and will eventually burn up. But the multi-plate transfer (MPT) clutch u
ses a special friction material that easily withstands the friction loads ge
nerated during torque transfer. (Also referred to as VTC = Variable Transfer
Clutch)
The MPT’s operation is controlled by the Transmission Control Unit (or TCU)
and constantly changes dependent on how the vehicle is being driven. To get
more all-wheel drive, the TCU increases the hydraulic pressure to the clutc
h for less slippage. Less all-wheel drive calls for more slip and the TCU re
duces the hydraulic pressure to the clutch.
Under normal, dry pavement operation torque split is about 90% front and 10%
rear. This distribution helps to compensate for the car’s weight distribut
ion and resultant smaller effective rolling diameter of the front tires. As
weight transfers to the rear of the vehicle, (i.e., under acceleration), the
TCU shifts the torque split more toward the rear wheels. Under hard braking
, torque is directed forward. Torque distribution is changed based upon how
the vehicle is being driven. Throttle position, gearshift lever position, cu
rrent gear and other factors combine to influence the TCU and it, in turn, s
elects a software map that determines how aggressively torque split will be
adjusted.
Two speed sensors are used by the TCU to detect wheel slippage. One sensor m
onitors the front axle set, the other the rear axle set. Pre-programmed vari
ables help the TCU differentiate between slipping wheels and normal wheel sp
eed differentials as what occurs when cornering. A speed differential (front
-to-rear) of up to 20% signals the TCU that the vehicle is cornering and tor
que is distributed to the front wheels to help increase traction during the
turn. Anything above 20%, however, indicates to the TCU that wheel slippage
is occurring and torque is then distributed to the rear wheels.
Another feature of the all-wheel drive system is its interaction with the an
ti-lock brake system. When ABS is engaged, the transmission selects third ge
ar, reducing the unpredictability of engine braking and, thus, reducing the
possibility of wheel lock-up. But all four wheels are still connected to the
engine through the AWD system and are brought back up to overall vehicle sp
eed quicker and can, therefore, be controlled again sooner. In a two-wheel d
rive system if the locking wheel isn’t a drive wheel, it can only be brough
t back up to overall wheel speed by whatever traction exists between it and
the road. The quicker a wheel is controlled the better the stopping performa
nce
(Source: http://www.autoworld.com/news/Subaru..._All-Wheel.htm)
A. Active AWD with Rear LSD: Available with Outback 2.5i
B. Active AWD without Rear LSD: Available with 4EAT on Impreza 2.5i, Legacy
2.5i, Legacy 2.5i Ltd
3. Variable Torque Distribution (VTD):
It has the MPT (multi plate transfer) clutch aka VTC as found in the Active
AWD system but it also has a planetary-type center differential and a Rear L
SD. The center differential provides the ability to have a default torque sp
lit of 45/55 front/rear (as against the 90/10 split in Active AWD). In every
other aspect it is similar to the Active AWD in that it anticipates wheel s
lippage instead of reacting to it as in the case of a MT. We can say the the
VTD is an advanced Active AWD system
Available with 4EAT on Impreza WRX
Available with 5EAT on Outback XT, Outback 3.0R, Legacy GT
4. Driver Controlled Center Differential (DCCD):
Uses an electronically managed multiplate transfer clutch and a mechanical l
imited-slip differential in conjunction with a planetary gear-type center di
fferential to control power distribution between the front and rear wheels.
Normally, DCCD splits power 41% front and 59% rear. Sensors monitor paramete
rs such as wheel slippage, steering angle, throttle position and braking to
help determine torque distribution and direct it to the wheels with optimum
traction. DCCD also features a helical-type limited-slip front differential
and a Torsen? limited-slip rear differential.
Available with 6MT on Impreza WRX Sti
Does my Subaru have a Rear LSD?
Another point of confusion is which Subarus have Rear Limited Slip Different
ials (Rear LSD) and which ones do not. For this you can refer to the list of
Subaru AWDs above where I have also listed the Subaru models which have tha
t type of AWD. But to make things even clearer heres a list of Subarus with
and without Rear LSD:
Subarus without Rear LSD:
Impreza 2.5i (5MT and 4EAT)
Outback Sport (5MT and 4EAT)
Legacy 2.5i (5MT and 4EAT)
Legacy 2.5i Ltd. (4EAT)
Subarus with Rear LSD:
Impreza WRX (5MT and 4EAT)
Outback 2.5i (5MT and 4EAT)
Outback XT (5MT and 5EAT)
Outback 3.0R (5EAT)
Legacy GT (5MT and 5EAT)
Spec.B (6MT)
WRX Sti (also has Front LSD)
As we all know that the center differential can split the torque in between
the front and the rear axles depending on the front/rear wheel slippage. But
its the Front and the Rear LSDs which can split the power between left and
right wheels. So it is very advantageous to have at least the Rear LSD if no
t the Front LSD. If the left rear wheel slips the Rear LSD can transfer the
power to the right rear wheel.
Subaru does not offer Rear LSDs in its lower models except in Outback 2.5i!!
which is understandable since it is designed for off-road conditions. (This
might explain the mpg difference in Outback 2.5i and Legacy 2.5i)
Which is Better?
Now that brings us to the next point of debate as to which one is better?
So here's an excerpt from an article I found:
(Source: http://www.cars.com/carsapp/cars/?sr...all_wheel.tmpl)
"Simpler AWD systems “bias” the power to the front or the rear in this way
and react to slippage when it occurs. Subaru's “continuous” AWD system is
this type. More advanced systems are designed to be proactive rather than r
eactive. For example, Subaru’s “active” AWD is claimed to anticipate and
prevent slippage for a seamless driving experience. Audi's quattro and relat
ed Volkswagen 4MOTION AWD systems route power based on vehicle dynamics: Rea
r tires have greater grip during acceleration, so during that action the rea
r wheels receive more of the engine’s power. In turns, the outside front wh
eel has the most grip and thus gets the most power, followed by both rear wh
eels.
With advanced AWD like this available on cars such as the Porsche 911 Carrer
a 4, it’s clear that four driven wheels are no longer the province of high-
ridin’ mud buggies. For surefooted handling during acceleration — even on
bone-dry roads — AWD is tough to beat."
As per the author of this article the Continuous AWD system found on Subarus
with 5MT and 6MT is a simpler system in that it is more reactive than proac
tive. Whereas the Active AWD systems (with Variable Transfer Clutch) found o
n 4EAT Subarus and the VTD (which is an advanced Active AWD system) found on
5EAT Subarus are proactive in predicting wheel slippage conditions and henc
e react faster. But obviously the Continuous AWD systems have the advantages
of being less complex and hence less prone to failures and low repair costs
.
So again which system is the best? I would say the order could be as follows
1. DCCD with Front and Rear LSDs - WRX Sti
2. VTD - 4EAT on WRX and 5EAT on Outback XT, Outback 3.0R and Legacy GT
3. Active AWD with Rear LSD: 4EAT on Outback 2.5i
4. Tie. Depends on what you need more? proactive AWD system or the Rear
LSD
(if offroading)
? Active AWD without Rear LSD: 4EAT on Impreza 2.5i, Legacy 2.5i and
Legacy
2.5i Ltd
? Continuous AWD with Rear LSD: 5MT on WRX, Legacy GT, Outback 2.5i,
Outback
XT and 6MT on spec.B
5. Continuous AWD without Rear LSD: 5MT on Impreza 2.5i and Legacy 2.5i
Subaru saves its best AWD system for the Impreza WRX Sti which has the DCCD
system with front and rear LSDs.
I wasnt aware that the Outback 2.5i has the Rear LSD. Thats an advantage ove
r the Legacy 2.5i. |
Y****a
发帖数: 17170 | 16
你的XC90有这些吗？
【在 f****t 的大作中提到】
: 俺2001年的outback基本配置有LSD、六碟音响和金钢不坏的4AT，新款基本配置有这些
: 吗?
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 17 要是torsen LSD还可以摆显一下. 你那个最弱的viscous LSD就不要出来献了.
六碟音响是啥? 能装6个CD的音响? 这个厉害呵. 呵呵
【在 f****t 的大作中提到】
: 俺2001年的outback基本配置有LSD、六碟音响和金钢不坏的4AT，新款基本配置有这些
: 吗?
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 18 这些我知道, 楼主看的是forester. forester在08年前, 和09年后的自动档都是属于
4EAT. 中央分动都是用的MPT. 为什么说forester的awd比以前缩水了?
新旧版forester 4EAT AWD的区别
老版(08年前)全时80：20分配(又有说法是90:10), 新版(09年后)全时60：40分配
老版(08年前)后轴用LSD, 但是是最弱的viscous LSD. 新版(09年后)用VDC代替, 14年
版加了xmode. 就是VDC on steroid
老版(08年前)的rear differential的size明显比09年后的小一圈
Subaru
al
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 主要说的是中央差速器。这个是网上一个文章。附件是现在的subaru中央差速器分类。
: There is a lot of confusion about the differences between the various Subaru
: AWD systems:
: ? Continuous (for 5MT)
: ? Active (for 4EAT)
: ? VTD (for 5EAT)
: ? availability or non-availability of Rear LSD
: So heres an attempt to explain the differences....
: 1. Continuous AWD System:
: The manual transmission’s all-wheel drive is referred to as a continuous al
|
Y****a
发帖数: 17170 | 19
现在谁还装CD呀。 嘿嘿
都是卫星，或者 上spotify什么的了。
【在 e**n 的大作中提到】
: 要是torsen LSD还可以摆显一下. 你那个最弱的viscous LSD就不要出来献了.
: 六碟音响是啥? 能装6个CD的音响? 这个厉害呵. 呵呵
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 20 我这个人就喜欢怀旧, 6 CD呵. 古董级的. 羡慕死我了. 呵呵呵
【在 Y****a 的大作中提到】
:
: 现在谁还装CD呀。 嘿嘿
: 都是卫星，或者 上spotify什么的了。
|
|
|
r*****j
发帖数: 7481 | |
B*Z
发帖数: 7062 | 22 我没专门说forester。主要是说6个气缸的outback和legacy。你的MPT是muliple plate
transfer unit？VDC是什么的简称？
ps. VDC就是普通的ESC之类的吧，每个车都有，subaru的有什么特殊之处？
【在 e**n 的大作中提到】
: 这些我知道, 楼主看的是forester. forester在08年前, 和09年后的自动档都是属于
: 4EAT. 中央分动都是用的MPT. 为什么说forester的awd比以前缩水了?
: 新旧版forester 4EAT AWD的区别
: 老版(08年前)全时80：20分配(又有说法是90:10), 新版(09年后)全时60：40分配
: 老版(08年前)后轴用LSD, 但是是最弱的viscous LSD. 新版(09年后)用VDC代替, 14年
: 版加了xmode. 就是VDC on steroid
: 老版(08年前)的rear differential的size明显比09年后的小一圈
:
: Subaru
: al
|
f****t
发帖数: 15913 | 23 別什么卫星了，都是些泥哥愛听的空洞音乐，有什么老中花钱听这个
【在 Y****a 的大作中提到】
:
: 现在谁还装CD呀。 嘿嘿
: 都是卫星，或者 上spotify什么的了。
|
Y****a
发帖数: 17170 | 24
给你推荐sportify吧，上面音乐应有尽有。
每个月花点钱，就可以直接offline，音质也是CD级的。
一进车里，蓝牙就连上，放歌，可爽了。
我开车一般都是听各种摇滚，非常过瘾。
【在 f****t 的大作中提到】
: 別什么卫星了，都是些泥哥愛听的空洞音乐，有什么老中花钱听这个
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 25 lz在问forester, 自然是默认讨论forester的awd了.
MPT是Multi Plate Transfer clutch. VDC是Vehicle Dynamics Control. 其中一部分
功能是代替LSD, subaru的特殊之处是forester(非XT版)在09年以前没有VDC
plate
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 我没专门说forester。主要是说6个气缸的outback和legacy。你的MPT是muliple plate
: transfer unit？VDC是什么的简称？
: ps. VDC就是普通的ESC之类的吧，每个车都有，subaru的有什么特殊之处？
|
s*****e
发帖数: 115 | 26 你也喜欢席勒的画？
【在 e**n 的大作中提到】
: 要是torsen LSD还可以摆显一下. 你那个最弱的viscous LSD就不要出来献了.
: 六碟音响是啥? 能装6个CD的音响? 这个厉害呵. 呵呵
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 27 马甲来了? 呵呵
是呵是啊. 席勒是我的all time favorite. 看名字你也喜欢席勒了?
【在 s*****e 的大作中提到】
: 你也喜欢席勒的画？
|
B*Z
发帖数: 7062 | 28 就算是只说forester也缩水了一些。最弱的vLSD也比VDC强吧？不缩水起码可以两个同
时有。
另外awd分布比率逐渐后移，是subaru更实诚了，还是clutch plate技术更成熟了？
【在 e**n 的大作中提到】
: lz在问forester, 自然是默认讨论forester的awd了.
: MPT是Multi Plate Transfer clutch. VDC是Vehicle Dynamics Control. 其中一部分
: 功能是代替LSD, subaru的特殊之处是forester(非XT版)在09年以前没有VDC
:
: plate
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 29 multi plate clutch, 据说是新版forester的plate的数量增加了, 所以torque能更多
得往后传. rear differential case的体积增大, 应该是为了handle更大的torque.
如果forester以前vLSD+VDC, 那现在算缩水, 但原来没有VDC, vLSD和VDC比, 谁强还不
好说. 不少人认为VDC比以前的vLSD强
"I tested this scenario on massive slab of 4 inch thick ice. I drive a 08
wrx MT with open front and rear diffs. I had mom and sister video the car
from both right and left sides getting on film front rear and right to left.
I turned lame mode(the TC button) off. This turns off TC exclusivley but
allows VDC the individual braking function that replaces lsd's to still
function. So when I revved to 3k and popped the clutch all 4 mofos (wheels)
where spinning. VDC uses the brakes and that can never be turned off, just
like you can't turn off an LSD. The 2007 wrx rear oem LSD might as well not
even exist since strenght of locking left and right wheels weak and
deteriates over time. It's hard to tell when an LSD is loosing power and
turning into an open diff, but in contrast it is easy to tell when you need
new brakes. Open front and rear diffs controlled by VDC are superior in
almost any situation specifically longevity for daily drivers, and you are
WRONG if you think open diffs with VDC intrudes on spirited driving because
it does not. You just have to understand the mechanics and therefor change
your driving style to accommodate the vehicle you are in. Aka the
Scandinavian flick, or chucking it into corners are methods that work best
with VDC and open diffs. Even though VDC is braking the slipping wheel it is
making sure both right and left spin The same speed. When slippage is
detected VDC is more powerful than an LSD, both are attempting to create 1:1
ratio (locked diff) where the right tire spins 1 whole rotation for every
whole rotation of the left tire. People may be used to driving mechanical
diffs and getting the rear end out easy, but when the rear slides out on an
07 the rear LSD is weak and basically open making it (funner) easier to keep
sliding out. When an 08 wrx gets the rear end out VDC provides almost a
locked diff effect via the brakes which is stronger than any oem rear LSD.
This is what you would really want if your driving balls to ze walls. In the
case of left wheels on Ice and right on dry road VDC will not achieve diff
lock the 1:1 rotation ratio, the brakes (2pot 1pot) aren't powerful enough
to stop 300tq from being applied to 2 wheels. The VDC software could be
programmed for the super extreme scenario of 2wheels purely on ice and 2
wheels purely on dry to achieve a 1:1 locked ratio but that would
destroy the weak brakes on the wrx just for the sake of this 1 specific
scenario. When all 4 wheels are either on exclusively dirt, snow, ice or dry
VDC is far superior to rear LSD's in providing a locked differential feel
in the event of loss of traction/ oversteer.
Subaru needs to pay me for this advertising that nobody else can explain."
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 就算是只说forester也缩水了一些。最弱的vLSD也比VDC强吧？不缩水起码可以两个同
: 时有。
: 另外awd分布比率逐渐后移，是subaru更实诚了，还是clutch plate技术更成熟了？
|
Y****a
发帖数: 17170 | 30
left.
)
我可以证明rear differential case的体积不小
【在 e**n 的大作中提到】
: multi plate clutch, 据说是新版forester的plate的数量增加了, 所以torque能更多
: 得往后传. rear differential case的体积增大, 应该是为了handle更大的torque.
: 如果forester以前vLSD+VDC, 那现在算缩水, 但原来没有VDC, vLSD和VDC比, 谁强还不
: 好说. 不少人认为VDC比以前的vLSD强
: "I tested this scenario on massive slab of 4 inch thick ice. I drive a 08
: wrx MT with open front and rear diffs. I had mom and sister video the car
: from both right and left sides getting on film front rear and right to left.
: I turned lame mode(the TC button) off. This turns off TC exclusivley but
: allows VDC the individual braking function that replaces lsd's to still
: function. So when I revved to 3k and popped the clutch all 4 mofos (wheels)
|
|
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 31 vLSD的一个问题就是里面的Viscous fluid会wear out. 用的越久就deteriorate的越厉
害, 结果就是慢慢的, Limited-slip differential变成了open differential.
不知道foxbat的outback开了多少年 |
B*Z
发帖数: 7062 | 32 是液体wear out还是clutch plates wear out？如果是液体，应该可以换的。
【在 e**n 的大作中提到】
: vLSD的一个问题就是里面的Viscous fluid会wear out. 用的越久就deteriorate的越厉
: 害, 结果就是慢慢的, Limited-slip differential变成了open differential.
: 不知道foxbat的outback开了多少年
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 33 如果你有机会看看09年以前的forester, 你就会知道现版forester的rear
differential case的体积比老版的大很多
【在 Y****a 的大作中提到】
:
: left.
: )
: 我可以证明rear differential case的体积不小
|
e**n
发帖数: 5876 | 34 是液体lose its viscosity, 最后就变成了open diff. viscous pack是密封的, 没
法单独换液体. 只能换整个LSD.
相比之下, VDC维护就太简单了, 换brake pad就成了.
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 是液体wear out还是clutch plates wear out？如果是液体，应该可以换的。
|
l*********u
发帖数: 19053 | 35 Forester烧机油，正被class action lawsuit
【在 Z**L 的大作中提到】
: 版上很多人说ford edge的AWD很弱，有什么具体依据吗？
: 另外在费城开车的话，同样的预算，买森林人还是edge？谢谢！
|
Z**L
发帖数: 1101 | 36 forester has no V6 version?
plate
【在 B*Z 的大作中提到】
: 我没专门说forester。主要是说6个气缸的outback和legacy。你的MPT是muliple plate
: transfer unit？VDC是什么的简称？
: ps. VDC就是普通的ESC之类的吧，每个车都有，subaru的有什么特殊之处？
|
