D******r
发帖数: 637 | 1 you can read the Amazon comments about the book
>
if this issue still bothers both of us. I will buy the ebook and post it da
y by day.
Do you think I should do this? |
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G*******s
发帖数: 4956 | 2 不用每日貼，你買來直接貼過來好了，如果有版權問題，你可以只給我一個人看
Servetus?
da |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 3 even such a staunch Calvinist as William Cunningham writes:
There can be no doubt that Calvin beforehand, at the time, and after the eve
nt, explicitly approved and defended the putting him [Servetus] to death, an
d assumed the responsibility of the transaction. |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 4 two charges against Micheal Michael Servetus
one is about infant baptism |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 5 two charges against Micheal Michael Servetus
one is about infant baptism |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 6 we don't usually call Abraham sinner
we call him the father of faith
calvinists call John Calvin, the murderer of Michael Servetus, the great spi
ritual person
so, it is not fair to simply call kongzi sinner.
Kongzi is a great teacher of this world. He is the father of the doctrine o
f LOVE |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 7 trinity is a man-made idea and enforced by military power
trinitarian brutally killed many non-followers
trinity is actually from Satan because of this brutality
Michael Servetus was burned by Calvinists for this Satanic theology |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 8 John Calvin supported the death penalty of Michael Servetus
cite:
"Heresy again became [under Calvin as under Augustine] ... treason to the st
ate, and was to be punished with death ... in one year,
on the advice of the Consistory, fourteen alleged witches were sent to the s
take on the charge that they had persuaded Satan to
afflict Geneva with plague"
from Will Durant, "Caesar and Christ," Pt. III of The Story of Civilization
(Simon and Schuster, 1950), 656. |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 9 << John 15:13 >>
Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends.
舍生取义，杀生成仁
Michael Servetus was a great Christian |
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b*********d
发帖数: 596 | 10 你的逻辑也有问题。祖先和后代之间的关系是血统，而Reo说的是神学观点和派别。比
如，Joseph Smith犯罪，多妻，凭此可以质疑他开创的摩门教；同样的，Jean Calvin
烧死和自己观点对立的Michael Servetus，那么Reo就因此质疑他的宗教观点 |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 11 this is my "offering serice to God"
what did John Calvin think when he supported the death penalty of Michael
Servetus? |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 12 Remember Jesus walked on the water before. Jesus was a superman. But Jesus
"lost" all his supernatural power after arrestment.
I also want to remind everybody how Michael Servetus was burned to death by
"reformed" Christians in Geneva four hundred years ago. His last word was "
Jesus, Son of the Eternal God, have mercy on me." |
|
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 14 "if a religious leader has a great moral failure, then there must be
something faulty in their doctrine."
wrath
rea
t
by
m |
|
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 16 By Stanford Rives
"By their fruits you shall know them." --Jesus
John Calvin was one of the most brilliant writers that the church has ever p
roduced. For this reason, his fame continues to this day, even as many Chri
stians regard themselves as Calvinists.
Calvin first professed Christ sometime around May 1534. Then within only on
e year, and while only 24 years of age, Calvin produced a complete synopsis
of Christian scripture and doctrine in a best-seller entitled
s of the Ch... 阅读全帖 |
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D******r
发帖数: 637 | 17 I will post this book day by day if calvinists still want to spread heresy
here
p
Chri
on
synopsis
Institute
it |
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Y**L
发帖数: 385 | 18 Let's find a better solution to let others get to know both ideas? |
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D******r
发帖数: 637 | 19 stop the heresy
return the to gospel
we can read bible together
but don't spread calvinism |
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Y**L
发帖数: 385 | 20 ok
can you fight with me but not against me? |
|
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Y**L
发帖数: 385 | 22 It is not heresy!
We can share the common points. But it is not heresy.
You should understand that. |
|
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 24 Calvinists burned Dr. Servetus for his denying infant baptism |
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e****i
发帖数: 2152 | 25 【 以下文字转载自 Military 讨论区 】
发信人: erkuai (三天不上bbs,赶得上刘少奇), 信区: Military
标 题: Re: 生物进化史终结了吗？
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Sep 13 00:40:48 2011, 美东)
Servetus burning at the stake
by Eduourd Elzingre (1909) |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 26 many calvinists today still support the burning of Dr. Servetus.
Mr. Huo verbally reprimanded the Calvinists for trespassing against the 6th
Commandment of "Shalt Not Kill". Mr. Huo avoided the criminal motivation
heavily based on the wrong doctrines of Calvinism.
Mr. Huo also said Hitler shall go to hell only because Hitler committed
suicide. It seems Hitler's destination has nothing to with his crimes
according to Mr. Huo. |
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D******r
发帖数: 637 | 27 塞尔维特怎么在各个地方被判死刑，怎么还活的好好的？
那个阿民年，可是全家被天主教当局杀光了
说明塞尔维特是个有影响力的人，他的科研成就也证明了这点
加尔文当时一些书信证明了加尔文早就有意处死塞尔维特，可不料塞尔维特真来了，加
尔文没有权力了，但他的精神领袖地位还在
塞尔维特被抓，反对加尔文的日内瓦掌权者就是有意要加尔文表态，加尔文就表态了要
处死塞尔维特
以后加尔文在各种书信里都反复说自己支持烧死异端
这些史料，我买了那本did calvin murder servetus贴出来就知道了 |
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l**********t
发帖数: 5754 | 28
JC's comments on 1;3
Concerning his own Son, etc. -- This is a remarkable passage, by
which we are taught that the whole gospel is included in Christ, so
that if any removes one step from Christ, he withdraws himself from the
gospel. For since he is the living and express image of the Father, it
is no wonder, that he alone is set before us as one to whom our whole
faith is to be directed and in whom it is to center. It is then a
definition of the gospel, by which Paul expresse... 阅读全帖 |
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R*o
发帖数: 3781 | 29 but Calvin did not confess his sin of murdering Servetus. Calvin go to hell
for sure.
they
stolen
surely
will
will |
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c****n
发帖数: 21367 | 30 摆事实讲道理怎么叫做语言暴力了？你扣这么个帽子，也得给个解释吧。
至于华人基督徒和KKK比，呵呵。
华人基督徒和KKK教徒哪边信心更足，读圣经读得更多，更有动力奉圣经为诫命，
你可以自己总结一下。要是比信心得救，100个KKK教徒得救，不知道有没有一个
华人基督徒得救。嘲笑KKK的，不如先看看自己。我说“宽容”，不是说华人基督徒
去“宽容”那些自己看起来是邪教的行为。主召唤的时候，杀个人都要犹豫
半天的华人基督徒才没这个资格。要也是KKK宽容圣餐徒。
另外 ，别以为华人基督徒信的教派就比KKK更“人性化”。就拿归正宗为例子吧。
加尔文表面上是反对火刑，可它提倡砍头。加尔文领导下的日内瓦宗教法庭烧死了
Servetus，然后还跨国追杀所有信Anabaptists的人。知道Anabaptists是啥么？
就是这个主题里的灵恩派的源头。
有些号称自己是基督徒的人啊，根本不知道基督教是什么。灵恩派呼喊派折腾一下
就觉得难以接受。那还信什么基督教。真以为圣经里面的杀婴屠城，父女相奸是写了
摆看的，是“落后时代的蒙昧”么？呵呵。
提示一下，为什么圣经里说：我来就是要使地上动刀兵。呵呵。 |
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q********g
发帖数: 10694 | 31 圣经无谬误的重要
在基督教教会的整个历史进程里，圣经均被视为原本由神所赐，绝无错误；这种信
念是信徒们所接纳的。除却那些与教会决裂，自立门户的异端以外，信徒都公认圣经拥
有完全的权威，所提及的一切事件一一包括神学上的、历史及科学上的，均属全然可信
。宗教改革期间，路德坚称：「当圣经说话，神就说话。」纵使反对路德的罗马天主教
，亦持守这个信念，虽然他们意图将教会传统置于与圣经等同的地位上。从昔日使徒保
罗所要与之抗辩的诺斯底主义开始，以至十八世纪自然神论冒升以前，都没有对圣经的
无谬误有所质疑。纵然是苏西尼(Socinus)及瑟维特(Michael Servetus)这些神体一位
论者(Unitarians；只信仰独一的真神，否认基督的神格及三一教义)，也根据圣经无谬
误来为自己的立场辩护。
但到了公元十八世纪，理性主义及自然神论兴起，圣经无谬误的地位便急转直下。
自然神论者与维护历史上基督信仰的正统派辩护者从此便划清界线。时至十九世纪，在
复原宗内居领导地位的学者，愈来愈多反对圣经的超自然事迹；这种风气促使美洲及欧
洲的「历史批判」兴起。充满着理性的读者们，都假设圣经纯粹是人类将有关宗... 阅读全帖 |
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N****n
发帖数: 6571 | 33 When and how did you lose your humanity?
While Pope Clement VIII just issued an order to burn Bruno to death, The
Devil Calvin deliberately had Servetus roasted at the stake with a slow fire
for a couple of hours, in order to satisfy his tyrannical and monstrous
disposition. |
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E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 36 摘要： 加爾文認為不該燒死，應該砍頭。
of
but |
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j*******7
发帖数: 6300 | 37 在战场上逃兵、投敌的是应该立刻枪毙。当时欧洲就是处于新教和天主教进行战争的状
态。 |
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w*********r
发帖数: 3382 | 39 “没有政治头脑的无用书生”就该被砍头？真是高见。。。 |
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N****n
发帖数: 6571 | 40 靠，难怪你们基督徒不认为希特勒是坏人。-----------加尔文和希特勒，有异曲同
工之妙。
楼主只恨自己没有权力在手，否则定要杀光异端和异教徒。 |
|
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w*********r
发帖数: 3382 | 42 你来总结一下他到底犯了什么罪，让你觉得他该杀，看看你的理由合不合法理，充不充分 |
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j*******7
发帖数: 6300 | 43 设想日本军队围攻南京时，有个国军跳出来说：“杀人有违天条，我们是仁义之师，请
大家放下武器，举手投降”。你意下如何？
充分 |
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w*********r
发帖数: 3382 | 44 然后日军把这个国军杀了就是顺理成章的事，就没有污点了是吧？ |
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j*******7
发帖数: 6300 | 45 更正：
设想日本军队围攻南京时，有个国军跳出来对中国人说：“杀人有违天条，我们国军是
仁义之师，请国军弟兄放下武器，举手投降”。你意下如何？ |
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w*********r
发帖数: 3382 | 46 你之前那个例子真是吓到我，还好你更正
更正之后还是有偷换概念
为什么日军代表天主教而国军代表新教？站在你情感的立场你愿意这么想，但是根本站
不住脚
日军的侵略恶行是有明确定义和记录的，凭什么你把这个头衔扣到天主教头上？
你列出的十几条里基本上全是在神学上的分歧，你竟然把这个对应成杀人掠地，拙劣了
点吧
神学上的分歧至于要杀人么？看来你觉得至于。。。
就算你把神学冲突类比成杀人掠地，那天主教也应该是国军，因为这里面侵略别人地盘
，杀人的是新教 |
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w*********r
发帖数: 3382 | 47 先别设想，请直接回答问题：
你来总结一下他到底犯了什么罪，让你觉得他该杀，看看你的理由合不合法理，充不充分 |
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j*******7
发帖数: 6300 | 48 我说的战争不是神学辩论的比喻，是货真价实流人血的战争 --
http://www.ccim.org/node/307
日内瓦的美丽使得日内瓦本身已经成为了优雅恬静与和平的代名词。其实日内瓦也是一
座为了追求自由独立而浴血奋战的城市。“法雷尔第一次来到日内瓦时，这里正在为自
由而战。她不属于任何一个行政区，为了独立，人们殊死奋斗。一百五十年来，日内瓦
人民以鲜血与那些想要统治他们的主教和公爵们抗争。” 勇敢的法雷尔给这座自由城
市带来了自由宗教的信息，为此日内瓦又要在自由与专制之间做出选择，他们选择了新
教，驱赶了天主教在日内瓦的统治，为此又进行了一场与罗马教廷彻底决裂的战争，近
两年时间日内瓦被围困，但是面对灭城的通牒，自由的日内瓦再一次取得了胜利。“大
家站在一起，举手宣誓以福音原则为生活的准则，弃决罗马教廷的那套东西，那天是
1536年5月21日，礼拜天。”
http://mkd.lyge.cn/a164/001.htm
宗教战争 |
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j*******7
发帖数: 6300 | 49 改进一下前面的总结：在战场上逃兵、投敌、惑乱军心的是应该立刻枪毙。当时欧洲就
是处于新教和天主教进行战争的状态。
充分 |
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w*********r
发帖数: 3382 | 50 大师你把事情搞大了
你用宗教的战争来justify个体杀人事情，那你用什么来justify宗教战争本身呢？
这种本末倒置的逻辑，太强大了 |
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