c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 1 可能是他们的软当，但也要向chris's boss 联系才有新的进展。另外一点就是他很难证明这到底是不是intention, 但对我们造成伤害了是事实。而且他们现在这么快改了和删帖子，就是心虚。 |
M******k
发帖数: 27573 | 2 1. Now -> NAO 是有racist倾向的语言,就象对着黑人学猴子叫一样.
2. GM has right to remove/hide, but do NOT have right to alternate the
original post.
both of them are unethical practices |
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 3 恩，从这个经理回信的速度来看，申述他们的语言/种族歧视绝对是他们的软档。他们
对游戏规则有解释权，这是他们的优势，要他们在这方面认输比较难。估计最后只能过
BBB, cc dispute对他们施加压力。但是是否歧视的解释权不在他们，如果我们很多人
抱怨歧视，他们会很难受的。美国公司最怕的就是被告歧视。 |
y******y
发帖数: 388 | 4 我觉得 还是要focus在我们并没有过度使用市场交换资源而被ban 同时又更多的违反游
戏规则的现象却没有被处理。 至于语言上的东西 可以用来加强说明gm素质低下业务能
力弱 |
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 5 对，所以我现在专攻这个方向，但需要一些帮助做online search. |
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 6 两手都要抓才硬。
从回复速度来看，他们绝对更担心被告歧视。
【在 y******y 的大作中提到】
: 我觉得 还是要focus在我们并没有过度使用市场交换资源而被ban 同时又更多的违反游
: 戏规则的现象却没有被处理。 至于语言上的东西 可以用来加强说明gm素质低下业务能
: 力弱
|
h*******e
发帖数: 1263 | |
r*********g
发帖数: 11078 | 8
嗯 以被歧视为由把钱要回来
然后再慢慢和他们磨这一条
【在 h*******e 的大作中提到】
: 对于歧视这条，没被ban的中国人也可以署名。
|
T***c
发帖数: 17256 | 9 没玩hommk，但这个 nao绝对是racist，虽然不是最恶劣的那种。
我想的起来的先例，奥胖当年“Tell Yao Ming, ‘ching-chong-yang-wah-ah-soh.’
”
最近的UCLA那个傻逼妞儿， "ching chong ling long”
这两个都是公认的racial taunt
再说了，racial不racial的，向来是被针对方说了算。
支持搞这个方向。
【在 M******k 的大作中提到】
: 1. Now -> NAO 是有racist倾向的语言,就象对着黑人学猴子叫一样.
: 2. GM has right to remove/hide, but do NOT have right to alternate the
: original post.
: both of them are unethical practices
|
y***l
发帖数: 1371 | |
|
|
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 11 @yiyil, thanks for the link. I am going to reply them with this link "
Racial Jokes - Learn Chinese in 5 Minutes". |
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 12 我打算这么写，大家来给点意见
One of our members found this link: http://www.afunworld.com/racial-jokes/joke-374.htm. The title of this page is "Racial Jokes - Learn Chinese in 5 Minutes". This page has several occurrences of "NAO"
* Please, stay a while longer. - Wai Go Nao
* Our meeting was scheduled for next week - Wai Yu Kum Nao
In all these sentences, “Nao” is used to represent “Now” in English.
Again, the title of the page is "Racial Jokes - Learn Chinese in 5 Minutes"!
!!
Please tell me why should we believe it is not a racial attack but some LEET
language? Chemzero spends so much time online and learn so many dirty
slangs. Do you want us to believe he didn’t know the exact meaning of his
own sentence?
You and other GMs taught us a lesson that we should be responsible for our
actions. We would like to teach Chemzero the same thing. He is not player
who can post anything and not be responsible for his own words. He is an
employee of UBI. He gets paid to sit in front a computer and write these
posts. We don’t pay him to write racial jokes to attack customers and
modify customers’ posts to humiliate them.
We demand these actions on your side:
1) Provide your immediate supervisor’s contact information. We would
like to raise this issue to him. You should fully understand the situation
by now and rethink your scope of responsibility.
2) Provide the physical location of your customer support office. We
would like to issue complaints to the local consumer right protection agency
or any agencies who will be interested to know the racial discrimination
and customer humiliation caused by a UBI employee. |
y***l
发帖数: 1371 | 13 "We don’t pay him to write racial jokes to attack customers and
modify customers’ posts to humiliate them. "
Also, you can strength the accuse of ChemZero modify Dizhu's posts. Ask
where in the UBI policy that a GM can offend the basic freedom right of
speech and modify players' post in forum? It is very serious in US of
modifying others posts without permission, it is against the basic freedom
right of speech.
"Provide your immediate supervisor’s contact information. We would
like to raise this issue to him. You should fully understand the situation
by now and rethink your scope of responsibility. "
Can add a sentence before this. "With all of these evidences, if you do not
want to take responsibility and actions. Then please...." 给他个台阶下. |
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 14 "You and other GMs taught us a lesson that we should be responsible for our
actions.We would like to teach Chemzero the same thing. He is not player who
can post anything and not be responsible for his own words.He is an
employee of UBI. He gets paid to sit in front a computer and write these
posts. We don’t pay him to write racial jokes to attack customers and
modify customers’ posts to humiliate them. "
This looks like that we admit we did something wrong, which is not true. The
paragraph can be written as:
Everyone should be responsible for what he has done.Chemzero is a member of
the support team of HMMK, whose role is to help the players, not to joke
about their languages or races. You might think it is a kind of humor, but
the fact is his joke hurts our feelings. Neither did we pay to appreciate
his racial jokes, nor did we pay to be humiliated by our own posts
intentionally revised by him. He owe us an apology.
At last, add:
We reserve our right for further actions |
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 15 修改版
One of our members found this link: http://www.afunworld.com/racial-jokes/joke-374.htm. The title of this page is "Racial Jokes - Learn Chinese in 5 Minutes". This page has several occurrences of "NAO"
* Please, stay a while longer. - Wai Go Nao
* Our meeting was scheduled for next week - Wai Yu Kum Nao
In all these sentences, “Nao” is used to represent “Now” in English.
Again, the title of the page is "Racial Jokes - Learn Chinese in 5 Minutes"!
!!
Please tell me why should we believe it is not a racial attack but some LEET
language? Chemzero spends so much time online and learn so many dirty
slangs. Do you want us to believe he didn’t know the exact meaning of his
own sentence?
Everyone should be responsible for what he has done. Chemzero is not player
who can post anything and not be responsible for his own words. He is a
member of the support team of HMMK, whose role is to help the players, not
to joke about their languages or races. You might think it is a kind of
humor, but the fact is his joke hurts our feelings. Neither did we pay to
appreciate his racial jokes, nor did we pay to be humiliated by our own
posts intentionally revised by him.
Please show me the UBI policy where authorizes a GM to modify a customer’s
post that is not contrary to the laws in force at the time or detrimental to
other members, Ubisoft staff or Ubisoft's right in general. Chemzero’s
behavior is against the basic freedom right of speech.
We demand these actions on your side:
1) With all of these evidences, if you do not want to take responsibility
and actions, please provide your immediate supervisor’s contact
information. We would like to raise this issue to him/her. You have been
very patient and cooperative to reply our emails. But it is time for you to
rethink your own scope of responsibility.
2) Provide us the physical location of your customer support office. We
would like to issue complaints to the local consumer right protection agency
or any agencies who will be interested to know the racial discrimination
and customer humiliation caused by a UBI employee.
We reserve our right for further actions |
r*********g
发帖数: 11078 | 16 有没有谁有懂法律的朋友，或者找律师给UBI在美国的部门（NC那个？）发一封律师函
的~~我愿意捐献钱来分担律师花费
由于1月后帐号就没有活动了就不能联名了 - - |
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 17 还是把这句话去掉吧“Chemzero is not player
who can post anything and not be responsible for his own words.“
玩家也要对他说过的话负责，否则可能会被关黑屋的。。 |
a**o
发帖数: 730 | 18 我也愿意捐钱。
【在 r*********g 的大作中提到】
: 有没有谁有懂法律的朋友，或者找律师给UBI在美国的部门（NC那个？）发一封律师函
: 的~~我愿意捐献钱来分担律师花费
: 由于1月后帐号就没有活动了就不能联名了 - -
|
m******P
发帖数: 263 | |
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | |
|
|
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 21 大家对我的回信还有其他修改意见吗？不然我就回信了。 |
n*****t
发帖数: 22014 | 22 俺先出两分钱：不要提 Racial Jokes，只需要告诉他我们有 strong evidence 说明
NAO 是种族歧视，就可以，没到出底牌的时候。 |
y***l
发帖数: 1371 | 23 发吧, 我觉得不错, 就把那个link发过去, 逼他们摊牌. 不用担心, 这几个racial
joke在很多地方都可以找到.
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20081104123836AA53j
【在 c*********8 的大作中提到】
: 大家对我的回信还有其他修改意见吗？不然我就回信了。
|
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 24 好的，我也觉得把link附上，没时间和他们婆妈。40摆在眼前。 |
c***g
发帖数: 224 | 25 If anyone is familiar with this, I would like to donate money and help
providing necessary evidence also.
【在 a**o 的大作中提到】
: 我也愿意捐钱。
|
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 26 "LEET" has evolved partly from a very popular site here in America called
www.lolcats.com . Here is a link to a LOLCAT translator that can actually
translate a normal english word or phrase to LOLCATS "Leet" speak: http://speaklolcat.com/ I just put the phrase "BAN ME NOW PLEASE OK THANKS BYE" and it translated to "BAN ME NAO PLZ K THX BAI". I hope that settles this.
Also, ChemZero doesn't spend "...so much time online and learn these dirty
slang terms" here at work. Honestly, that accusation is insulting. You and
your alliance members keep insisting that we violated your freedom of speech
, but this is wrong on two levels:
1) You have to be in the United States in order for the United States Laws
to protect your freedom of speech
2) The Freedom of Speech applies to PUBLIC locations, NOT PRIVATE FORUMS
owned by Ubisoft. You must sign up for an account to use our PRIVATE forums
so therefore, there is no freedom of speech protection for our members.
I'm done defending my GM's actions at this point. We've banned players for
Auction House pushing before you, and we will continue to do so. Also, we
don't give refunds for unused time resulting from a ban or suspension. You
were only kicked from playing on Dragon Legacy 2, you can still play on any
of our other servers worldwide. This matter is closed.
Sincerely,
Spamhain
MMO Support Manager |
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 27 My mistake. Your IP looked like it was being routed from outside the United
States, so I apologize. I refer you then to my 2nd point. You don't have
freedom of speech on PRIVATE forums.
And yes, this matter IS over.
Spamhain |
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 28 Just a quick response to your first point
1) You have to be in the United States in order for the United States Laws
to protect your freedom of speech |
y******y
发帖数: 388 | 29 这个人是个2b啊
直接把这些东西发给他老板说我们准备sue了
别的不说就说gm公开发表歧视性的言论 |
y******y
发帖数: 388 | 30 不要和伊讨论说这个词是不是歧视性的 就直接说sue伊和伊的gm
反正就是说要弄的谁都知道ubisoft游戏管是非常混乱低能无知的
实在不行可以给议员写信 |
|
|
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 31 这下沙蔽GM赤裸裸地暴露了他们的歧视了吧.他们吃定了我们就是以为我们人不在美国.
对美国玩家他们肯定不敢这么为所欲为的.他的回信也可以当作歧视的间接证据. |
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 32 而且他们删我们的账号的主要原因是主观歧视,而不是客观事实.请参考置顶贴
【在 y******y 的大作中提到】
: 这个人是个2b啊
: 直接把这些东西发给他老板说我们准备sue了
: 别的不说就说gm公开发表歧视性的言论
|
y***l
发帖数: 1371 | 33 directly send him a letter something like this,
Are you be able to on behalf of the UBI soft North American Inc. management
to take all the responsibilities and consequences for what happened next? If
not, PROVIDE your immediate surpervisor contact information, and we'd like
to talk with him to see if there is a policy in UBI soft that GM can use
racial jokes and modify players post in the forum to mocking them.
Also, I found these two person from their website, who we may be able to
contact.
Jaime Cottini
Director, Public Relations
j***********[email protected]
625 Third Street
San Francisco - CA 94107
Tel: +1 (415) 547 4000
Fax: +1 (415) 547 4001
Lisa Revelli
Corporate Communication Manager
l**********[email protected]
Ubisoft/Red Storm Entertainment
2000 CentreGreen Way
Suite 300
Cary, NC 27513
1.919.460.1776
And also I found this:
LAURENT DETOC
Executive Director, North America
A graduate of the “Institut Supérieur de Gestion” business school in
Paris, Laurent Detoc joined Ubisoft in 1991. Two years later, he left the
headquarters in France to set up a subsidiary for Belgium and the
Netherlands. In 1994, he took charge of the San Francisco office.
Experiences in Germany, Belgium and now the United States have enriched
Laurent’s global business vision – a true asset in today’s gaming
industry.
As Executive Director of Ubisoft’s North American distribution unit,
Laurent is today responsible for Ubisoft’s publishing activities in North
America. His goals include becoming a leading video game publisher and
employer of choice throughout North America. Thanks to his team’s efforts,
Ubisoft was the 3rd independent editor in North America in 2009.
And this:
Business office
625 Third Street
San Francisco - CA 94107
Tel: +1 (415) 547 4000
Fax: +1 (415) 547 4001
Ubisoft Red Storm Entertainment
2000 Centre Green Way
Suite 300
Cary, NC 27513
Tel: +1 (919) 460 1776 |
s****n
发帖数: 1750 | 34 这帮傻逼，以为自己上帝呀。我也愿意捐钱，搞死他们 |
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 35 大家不要把查询的结果贴出来，好像不应该在公共网站放个人信息。可以内部发信交流
。 |
s****n
发帖数: 1750 | 36 另外，贡献下我的意见
如果要sue,不要sue ubi.而是sue 这个chemzero和这个spamhain.如果sue公司，他们家
大业大，没啥希望。如果sue个人，ubi十有八九会丢车保帅。以前我们学校有个老黑
administrative staff就是这样，天天在学校P都不干，谁都不敢开她。哪个manager敢
雷她，她就往racial discrimination上靠，然后威胁要告这个人（不是学校）。学校
为了省麻烦，也不会为个人出头。 |
y***l
发帖数: 1371 | 37 这写信息是我从UBI.COM查到的, 他们公开的. 我现在比较忙, 也帮不上什么具体的忙.
我觉得可以先问那个家伙他是不是能代表UBI北美的官方意见, 他是不是认为GM修改别
人玩家的 forum post, 然后用来joke around, 是符合UBI的policy. 他是不是认为一个从Chinese racial joke里提取的Chinese单词只是个 American leet language word. 如果他说是, 就
把他email汇总下发给那两个public relation的人让他们确定他的代表合法性. 如果确
定合法, 那就直接告UBI北美, 告的对方越大, 律师越愿意接受.
如果他说不是, 就让他提供他能代表的上级的contact information. 要不, 你就说我们
就只能用UBI上查到的他们的executive director的contact information直接联系
executive director了.
【在 c*********8 的大作中提到】
: 大家不要把查询的结果贴出来，好像不应该在公共网站放个人信息。可以内部发信交流
: 。
|
a**o
发帖数: 730 | 38 看看GM的新回复，they banned us on "chances"!
1) I don't expect "every" player to keep up with the forums as much as some
others do, but in your case the Alliance Leader was part of that
conversation and 2 other MiTBBS members were as well. Since they were
present for this conversation, if falls on them to notify their alliance
members that what they were doing was not allowed. In a game that functions
off Alliances and coordination, chances are at least 1 of the members in an
alliance will at least read the forums.
2) We're currently looking at Legion, and the other alliances on Dragon
Legacy 2 as well. And we didn't ban you pretty quickly. We started looking
at your alliance several days before we banned you because of players
complaining that you were going above your member cap.
On a side note, the GM's aren't required to explain the reasons for their
actions to the players. If a GM abuses their power, that is when I step in
and discipline them or worse. This threat keeps my GM's obeying the rules I
have given them.
Sincerely,
Spamhain
MMO Support Manager |
c*********8
发帖数: 608 | 39 Legion 的prestor因为多帐号被ban了。 |
l******e
发帖数: 3426 | 40 Spamhain
MMO Support Manager
他是GM的直接上司吧？ 今天我在另外一个server，也是用的MITBBS的名号建的
alliance,我收到他的信了。说不要用market trade，我准备回信问问他，怎么定义用
market trade还是你情我愿，一个卖一个买。这定义本就很模糊，他说不清楚，不能量
化的话，那就没办法定1服的罪。 |
|
|
y***l
发帖数: 1371 | 41 how to get the complain to this guy? I'm done with talking with MrGriM and I
think I can get some bullets to attack him now.
some
functions
an
【在 a**o 的大作中提到】
: 看看GM的新回复，they banned us on "chances"!
: 1) I don't expect "every" player to keep up with the forums as much as some
: others do, but in your case the Alliance Leader was part of that
: conversation and 2 other MiTBBS members were as well. Since they were
: present for this conversation, if falls on them to notify their alliance
: members that what they were doing was not allowed. In a game that functions
: off Alliances and coordination, chances are at least 1 of the members in an
: alliance will at least read the forums.
: 2) We're currently looking at Legion, and the other alliances on Dragon
: Legacy 2 as well. And we didn't ban you pretty quickly. We started looking
|
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 42 file complaint on www.bbb.org
complain customer service -> inappropriate behaviors of personnel
example:
http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t/Game/31351637.html
I
【在 y***l 的大作中提到】
: how to get the complain to this guy? I'm done with talking with MrGriM and I
: think I can get some bullets to attack him now.
:
: some
: functions
: an
|
a**o
发帖数: 730 | 43 这个人是ｍａｎａｇｅｒ，在ｕｂｉ．ｃｏｍ上选ｓｕｐｐｏｒｔ，最后ｃｏｍｐｌａ
ｉｎ会到她手里。
I
【在 y***l 的大作中提到】
: how to get the complain to this guy? I'm done with talking with MrGriM and I
: think I can get some bullets to attack him now.
:
: some
: functions
: an
|
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 44 是说Spamhain吗? 据他称他是MMO Support Manager, 那几个GM都是他训练出来的.
给他写信没用.每次只会用些模板回信,根本不解答你的问题.公司内部的人只会相互包
庇,不用指望有好的解决方案.还是要利用消费者维权机构从外部施加压力.
【在 a**o 的大作中提到】
: 这个人是ｍａｎａｇｅｒ，在ｕｂｉ．ｃｏｍ上选ｓｕｐｐｏｒｔ，最后ｃｏｍｐｌａ
: ｉｎ会到她手里。
:
: I
|
h*********n
发帖数: 5789 | 45 大家都集中力量投诉ChemZero, 打掉一个立威，让他们知道中国人不是好欺负的。
【在 m******P 的大作中提到】
: 是说Spamhain吗? 据他称他是MMO Support Manager, 那几个GM都是他训练出来的.
: 给他写信没用.每次只会用些模板回信,根本不解答你的问题.公司内部的人只会相互包
: 庇,不用指望有好的解决方案.还是要利用消费者维权机构从外部施加压力.
|
c***g
发帖数: 224 | 46 I got reply for my ticket. pretty much the same crap. It looks like that
he can only defend his action at most. he didnt say anything about chemzero
's insulting words.
It takes the same amount of time to deliver a sale on the AH, but there is
no limit to the number of caravans making deliveries from the AH. You can
only have one merchant caravan "out" delivering resources at any given time,
but using the Auction House to move these same goods doesn't follow that
same restriction. This allows players in an alliance to quickly move
resources to each other with no limit to the number of caravans. This was
openly discussed during season 1 on this thread: http://forums-mightandmagicheroeskingdoms.ubi.com/us/read.php?51,152811,153801#msg-153801
Also notice, your Alliance leader and 2 other alliance members participated
in this conversation. I'm done defending my GM's actions at this point. We'
ve banned players for Auction House pushing before you, and we will continue
to do so. You were only kicked from playing on Dragon Legacy 2, you can
still play on any of our other servers worldwide, and we hope you do. This
matter is closed.
Sincerely,
Spamhain
MMO Support Manager |
m******P
发帖数: 263 | 47 跟给我的回信一模一样。看都不看我们的申述信，就不用对他抱指望。只能从外部施加
压力了。
你不是已经BBB了？还是先等着BBB的结果再说。 |
