p***n
发帖数: 635 | 1 看了些网上可以下载的基于.NET
的PORTAL框架,象RAINBOW,IBUYSPY
觉得比WEBLOGIC PORTAL差了不少.
现在我对.NET的整体感觉就是基本的
架子是搭起来了,IDE也很不错,但是
真正有利于二次开发的平台还不存在.
有些东西象CMS SDK,CRM SDK,很不错,
但是过于专门化了,SHAREPOINT PORTAL
又很弱.
对这些比较了解的大虾能不能谈一谈? | st
发帖数: 1685 | 2 I never undertsand why companies spend money for portal, the company I work
for is partner with IBM for portal etc...
【在 p***n 的大作中提到】
: 看了些网上可以下载的基于.NET
: 的PORTAL框架,象RAINBOW,IBUYSPY
: 觉得比WEBLOGIC PORTAL差了不少.
: 现在我对.NET的整体感觉就是基本的
: 架子是搭起来了,IDE也很不错,但是
: 真正有利于二次开发的平台还不存在.
: 有些东西象CMS SDK,CRM SDK,很不错,
: 但是过于专门化了,SHAREPOINT PORTAL
: 又很弱.
: 对这些比较了解的大虾能不能谈一谈?
| p***n
发帖数: 635 | 3 i guess it is sth that biz people like but techies don't
all those TTM, TCO bragging and bullshitting ...
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: I never undertsand why companies spend money for portal, the company I work
: for is partner with IBM for portal etc...
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 4 that's my feeling, since I dont see which end customers want to pay for that,
all I know are those big firms pay extra cash for those "portal" nobody would
really use.... (as EMC2 paid multi-million for those portal tools but never
used in their company)
【在 p***n 的大作中提到】
: i guess it is sth that biz people like but techies don't
: all those TTM, TCO bragging and bullshitting ...
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 5 They use portal for intranet publishing. Kind of cooperation between employees
or news publishing.
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: I never undertsand why companies spend money for portal, the company I work
: for is partner with IBM for portal etc...
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 6 enh? the portals we provide are just news/financial information with
customization options, etc... we sold A LOT portals to various companies, you
think those "content" portal is of any use at all?
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: They use portal for intranet publishing. Kind of cooperation between employees
: or news publishing.
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 7 Hehe. Government will use it.
Zope is a good example. It's customers are NATO, national research groups,
bank of america and boston.com.
Hehe. It's useful. Sort of content management system.
that,
would
work
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: that's my feeling, since I dont see which end customers want to pay for that,
: all I know are those big firms pay extra cash for those "portal" nobody would
: really use.... (as EMC2 paid multi-million for those portal tools but never
: used in their company)
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 8 guess the portals we make is some kind of different, I just think who ever
bought those we make are wasting their money, IMHO.
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: Hehe. Government will use it.
: Zope is a good example. It's customers are NATO, national research groups,
: bank of america and boston.com.
: Hehe. It's useful. Sort of content management system.
:
: that,
: would
: work
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 9 hmm. I don't know.
But if the company use a good portal, they don't need tech ppl to help them
publish content any more. Almost every one can publish news and other
information. The company can save money for paying tech ppl and can make the
publishing procedure faster.
At least, they provide a lot of information online and they can do data mining
later.
you
employees
work
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: enh? the portals we provide are just news/financial information with
: customization options, etc... we sold A LOT portals to various companies, you
: think those "content" portal is of any use at all?
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 10 I really dont see those "benefits" are worth the money for any portal...
those things can be done by simpler tools, usually nobody really needs to
publish content, for a company really provides feed, they have their own tool
to publish content, as I know.(we deal with many feeds)
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: hmm. I don't know.
: But if the company use a good portal, they don't need tech ppl to help them
: publish content any more. Almost every one can publish news and other
: information. The company can save money for paying tech ppl and can make the
: publishing procedure faster.
: At least, they provide a lot of information online and they can do data mining
: later.
:
: you
: employees
| | | L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 11 I am not sure what you did in your company.
But for government, newspaper, radio station, they have a workflow like this:
1. collect informaiton by professionals who is not computer geek
2. they fill the content using a pre-defined template.
3. the portal can publish the content online
4. at the same time, the portal can generate the pdf file for hard copies.
So basically,
Model: raw data
Control: work flow
View: online web pages, pdfs, report ...
Just my thought. I think the most important part
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: I really dont see those "benefits" are worth the money for any portal...
: those things can be done by simpler tools, usually nobody really needs to
: publish content, for a company really provides feed, they have their own tool
: to publish content, as I know.(we deal with many feeds)
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 12 at least what EMC2 purchased from weblogic is totally different "portal" thing.
we provide this kind of publishing service, but we dont call it portal either.
we have weather/news/financial portals just showing some news/information with
customization functionality... and there might be other product...
and the most important, IMHO, thoes 1-4 you mentioned down there, dont worth
much money... as the price tag for portal is not that low and many firms are
buying them, so I am still confused.
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: I am not sure what you did in your company.
: But for government, newspaper, radio station, they have a workflow like this:
: 1. collect informaiton by professionals who is not computer geek
: 2. they fill the content using a pre-defined template.
: 3. the portal can publish the content online
: 4. at the same time, the portal can generate the pdf file for hard copies.
: So basically,
: Model: raw data
: Control: work flow
: View: online web pages, pdfs, report ...
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 13 I agree that the tech part what I was talking about is trivial. It's just the
base of the portal. No company will buy something like that.
Maybe the important part is customized "business logic"? The workflow?
Which is called "solution"?
This is not the off-the-shelf product. I think.
thing.
either.
with
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: at least what EMC2 purchased from weblogic is totally different "portal" thing.
: we provide this kind of publishing service, but we dont call it portal either.
: we have weather/news/financial portals just showing some news/information with
: customization functionality... and there might be other product...
: and the most important, IMHO, thoes 1-4 you mentioned down there, dont worth
: much money... as the price tag for portal is not that low and many firms are
: buying them, so I am still confused.
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 14 the stuff I know are just "trivial" stuff, from weblogic or from my company,
and they price tag it high.... see why I am confused now?
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: I agree that the tech part what I was talking about is trivial. It's just the
: base of the portal. No company will buy something like that.
: Maybe the important part is customized "business logic"? The workflow?
: Which is called "solution"?
: This is not the off-the-shelf product. I think.
:
: thing.
: either.
: with
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 15 hehe. interesting.
Does this mean the need of this kind of system is pretty high? Maybe we
can do the same business. :)
Or maybe this is a lot of labor work. You know, labor fee is pretty high
in US. :)
the
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: the stuff I know are just "trivial" stuff, from weblogic or from my company,
: and they price tag it high.... see why I am confused now?
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 16 You company's solutions are based on Java? As weblogic's solution?
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: the stuff I know are just "trivial" stuff, from weblogic or from my company,
: and they price tag it high.... see why I am confused now?
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 17 mixed, some part is,with some asp as well,sql server-java middle tier-xslt->asp
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: You company's solutions are based on Java? As weblogic's solution?
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 18 not even that much labor, that's what confused me the most.
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: hehe. interesting.
: Does this mean the need of this kind of system is pretty high? Maybe we
: can do the same business. :)
: Or maybe this is a lot of labor work. You know, labor fee is pretty high
: in US. :)
:
: the
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 19 faint. That looks like "easy money". :)
company,
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: not even that much labor, that's what confused me the most.
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 20 indeed, at least for a few examples, they paid a huge amount but no need
for the "portal" and never use it... //sigh.. weird, isnt it?
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: faint. That looks like "easy money". :)
:
: company,
| | | L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 21 That really confused me.
1. SQL server + java = not good performance. At least worse than SQL Server +
.Net
2. Why asp as front end? The solution has a portable back end, why put a
platform specific front end? Just want to use some ActiveX control?
tier-xslt->asp
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: mixed, some part is,with some asp as well,sql server-java middle tier-xslt->asp
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 22 we had many legacy things, and company is not ready to use .net yet, new merged
company is more ready but it takes time....
you are not working, are you? in company, it's not really what is good matters,
some guy only know java was in charge of production, they rewrite java classes
all the time and they had to work very late every night to get things done in
THEIR WAY, taht's why java was used, they only know java and hate M$.
asp was used long time ago, we use pc version, some jsp but mostly as
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: That really confused me.
: 1. SQL server + java = not good performance. At least worse than SQL Server +
: .Net
: 2. Why asp as front end? The solution has a portable back end, why put a
: platform specific front end? Just want to use some ActiveX control?
:
: tier-xslt->asp
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 23 I C. Thanks.
merged
matters,
classes
in
now)
Server +
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: we had many legacy things, and company is not ready to use .net yet, new merged
: company is more ready but it takes time....
: you are not working, are you? in company, it's not really what is good matters,
: some guy only know java was in charge of production, they rewrite java classes
: all the time and they had to work very late every night to get things done in
: THEIR WAY, taht's why java was used, they only know java and hate M$.
: asp was used long time ago, we use pc version, some jsp but mostly as
| w********c
发帖数: 2632 | 24 I read a document from websphere portal server group a couple of months ago.
their projection of the whole portal market this year is like a few million
dollars, miserable compared with the application server market.
mining
【在 L*******r 的大作中提到】
: hmm. I don't know.
: But if the company use a good portal, they don't need tech ppl to help them
: publish content any more. Almost every one can publish news and other
: information. The company can save money for paying tech ppl and can make the
: publishing procedure faster.
: At least, they provide a lot of information online and they can do data mining
: later.
:
: you
: employees
| p***n
发帖数: 635 | 25 是不是PORTAL都不太好说.现在这些VENDOR的PORTAL策略大多是
和APPLICATION SERVER捆绑, 计算纯粹的PORTAL REVENUE 和
MARKET 的大小也有一定难度.
【在 w********c 的大作中提到】
: I read a document from websphere portal server group a couple of months ago.
: their projection of the whole portal market this year is like a few million
: dollars, miserable compared with the application server market.
:
: mining
| L*******r
发帖数: 1011 | 26 俺个人觉得实用的portal是intranet合作平台。一个分散在各地的group，大家互相合作
，资源共享，最后形成一个内部的知识库。
老实说，现在做的portal和当年的MIS没有什么区别。只不过技术更新而已。
web logic portal的介绍上说：
"to improve productivity and reduce cost by integrating and simplifying
information service".
呵呵，这样定义portal可就广了去了。
weblogic portal的功能模块包括：content management, search, collaboration,
interaction management and commerce.
a few million dollars? 随便几个公司的project就不止这么多了吧，如果全行业就这
么小块饼，我想没人做了。
ago.
million
【在 p***n 的大作中提到】
: 是不是PORTAL都不太好说.现在这些VENDOR的PORTAL策略大多是
: 和APPLICATION SERVER捆绑, 计算纯粹的PORTAL REVENUE 和
: MARKET 的大小也有一定难度.
| st
发帖数: 1685 | 27 I remember portal market was projected a lot higher before, as EMC2 spent
a lot for portal back in the golden old days when they had a lot cash. :D
this a few million is more like normal demand. :D
【在 w********c 的大作中提到】
: I read a document from websphere portal server group a couple of months ago.
: their projection of the whole portal market this year is like a few million
: dollars, miserable compared with the application server market.
:
: mining
| p***n
发帖数: 635 | 28 amazing enough, EMC2 purchased Documentum today, a leading CMS
company.
【在 st 的大作中提到】
: I remember portal market was projected a lot higher before, as EMC2 spent
: a lot for portal back in the golden old days when they had a lot cash. :D
: this a few million is more like normal demand. :D
|
|
