h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 1 No need for you to prove anything because it's unprovable. Just give your
reasoning behind. Whatever you have. I will not label you by some cheap
labels.
I will give one first:
Life is so beautiful! |
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 2
What's a "reason" for? Why is "Life is so beautiful" even remotely
related to eternal life?
I'm not criticizing you (yet). I really don't see the connection or
relevance.
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: No need for you to prove anything because it's unprovable. Just give your
: reasoning behind. Whatever you have. I will not label you by some cheap
: labels.
: I will give one first:
: Life is so beautiful!
|
h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 3 Why do you think there is no eternal life? If you want to prove it, go ahead
though it's not required.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: What's a "reason" for? Why is "Life is so beautiful" even remotely
: related to eternal life?
: I'm not criticizing you (yet). I really don't see the connection or
: relevance.
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 4 Also, your life might be beautiful. Many others may say otherwise.
Go to google image search, type in "starving", then tell me
again life is beautiful. |
h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 5 sure. Please answer my question.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
: Also, your life might be beautiful. Many others may say otherwise.
: Go to google image search, type in "starving", then tell me
: again life is beautiful.
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 6
ahead
If you seriously want me to answer, tell me what is eternal life.
For example, what do you have left after your material body decomposed.
Do you still have the look? the memory? family? intelligence? suffering? etc.
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: Why do you think there is no eternal life? If you want to prove it, go ahead
: though it's not required.
|
w******g
发帖数: 10018 | 7 Is your life beautiful? If you can lose your life to save one of them, do
you want to do it?
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
: Also, your life might be beautiful. Many others may say otherwise.
: Go to google image search, type in "starving", then tell me
: again life is beautiful.
|
i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 8 Life is pain because of sin. |
a***g
发帖数: 2402 | 9 你不是神，所以你说的话需要有逻辑。
我猜你想说生命是如此美好，那么永生将让这美好的生命持续到永远。可你要知道，你
现在的生命和神应许的永生是不一样的。你真的了解什么是永生吗？你连你要永生干什
么都不知道，你凭什么断言永生也是美好的呢？
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: No need for you to prove anything because it's unprovable. Just give your
: reasoning behind. Whatever you have. I will not label you by some cheap
: labels.
: I will give one first:
: Life is so beautiful!
|
i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 10 人生下来就是痛苦的，从baby第一声啼哭开始。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: Life is pain because of sin.
|
|
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 11
六樓
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: sure. Please answer my question.
|
a***g
发帖数: 2402 | 12 说实话，我从好久以前就觉得你是在搞无间道：）
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 人生下来就是痛苦的，从baby第一声啼哭开始。
|
h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 13 What is in your mind about eternal life or you don't have this concept at
all?
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: 六樓
|
i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 14 唯有信耶稣，心里才有喜乐，生命不再一样。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 人生下来就是痛苦的，从baby第一声啼哭开始。
|
h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 15 Eternal life is something beautiful, I guess.
【在 a***g 的大作中提到】
: 你不是神，所以你说的话需要有逻辑。
: 我猜你想说生命是如此美好，那么永生将让这美好的生命持续到永远。可你要知道，你
: 现在的生命和神应许的永生是不一样的。你真的了解什么是永生吗？你连你要永生干什
: 么都不知道，你凭什么断言永生也是美好的呢？
|
i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 16 不但现在喜乐，将来更有永生。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 唯有信耶稣，心里才有喜乐，生命不再一样。
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 17
I do, vaguely though. But I think I know no less than you.
Let me post the article again and see if you know more than me.
另開主題
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: What is in your mind about eternal life or you don't have this concept at
: all?
|
i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 18 俺喜欢实事求是讨论，不戴有色眼镜，这样看问题更清楚。
【在 a***g 的大作中提到】
: 说实话，我从好久以前就觉得你是在搞无间道：）
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | |
h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 20 That is called faith.
【在 a***g 的大作中提到】
: 你不是神，所以你说的话需要有逻辑。
: 我猜你想说生命是如此美好，那么永生将让这美好的生命持续到永远。可你要知道，你
: 现在的生命和神应许的永生是不一样的。你真的了解什么是永生吗？你连你要永生干什
: 么都不知道，你凭什么断言永生也是美好的呢？
|
|
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 21
or superstition, or wishful thinking.
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: That is called faith.
|
h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 22 hehe, I now kind of know you hate faith. Is that true?
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: or superstition, or wishful thinking.
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 23 If you are really interested in knowing. I can recommend you two books to
read. You might have an idea of what the afterlife is like.
"Heaven is for real", "90 minutes in heaven"
etc.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: or superstition, or wishful thinking.
|
w******g
发帖数: 10018 | 24 I don't believe any one of them.
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: If you are really interested in knowing. I can recommend you two books to
: read. You might have an idea of what the afterlife is like.
: "Heaven is for real", "90 minutes in heaven"
:
: etc.
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 25
I won't. And you won't. What does this has to do with the topic?
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: Is your life beautiful? If you can lose your life to save one of them, do
: you want to do it?
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 26 前些時候有人貼了一部份。別說我， 你真的相信嗎？
你應該知道其他宗教的事蹟更多吧？ 尤其是前世今生之類的。
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: If you are really interested in knowing. I can recommend you two books to
: read. You might have an idea of what the afterlife is like.
: "Heaven is for real", "90 minutes in heaven"
:
: etc.
|
w******g
发帖数: 10018 | 27 Jesus did. That's the difference. We talked about the starved children again
and again, but he is just a talking topic to us. You criticize me with him,
I also criticize you with him. That's human.
We are not talking about if Jesus has done his job well, but at least he did
do it. Not a single human being can do this.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
: 前些時候有人貼了一部份。別說我， 你真的相信嗎？
: 你應該知道其他宗教的事蹟更多吧？ 尤其是前世今生之類的。
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 28 耶稣作了的证据呢？李大师也作了，你信不信？青海大师也作了，你信不信？
again
him,
did
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: Jesus did. That's the difference. We talked about the starved children again
: and again, but he is just a talking topic to us. You criticize me with him,
: I also criticize you with him. That's human.
: We are not talking about if Jesus has done his job well, but at least he did
: do it. Not a single human being can do this.
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 29 推荐你看三言二拍，希腊神话，比这个精彩
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: If you are really interested in knowing. I can recommend you two books to
: read. You might have an idea of what the afterlife is like.
: "Heaven is for real", "90 minutes in heaven"
:
: etc.
|
A*********e
发帖数: 4361 | 30 那现在呢
【在 a***g 的大作中提到】
: 说实话，我从好久以前就觉得你是在搞无间道：）
|
|
|
w******g
发帖数: 10018 | 31 At least we saw some literature. That way of belief is different from other
teachings.
【在 l*****a 的大作中提到】
: 耶稣作了的证据呢？李大师也作了，你信不信？青海大师也作了，你信不信？
:
: again
: him,
: did
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 32 是啊，所以宗教经常也会和骗术，洗脑，传销等等好东西连在一起
other
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: At least we saw some literature. That way of belief is different from other
: teachings.
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 33 And why is that?
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: I don't believe any one of them.
|
l**********t
发帖数: 5754 | 34
Amen.
John:
4:13 耶 稣 回 答 说 ， 凡 喝 这 水 的 ， 还 要 再 渴 。
4:14 人 若 喝 我 所 赐 的 水 就 永 远 不 渴 。 我 所 赐 的 水 ， 要 在 他 里
头 成 为 泉 源 ， 直 涌 到 永 生 。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 唯有信耶稣，心里才有喜乐，生命不再一样。
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 35 你的永生到手没有？
【在 l**********t 的大作中提到】
:
: Amen.
: John:
: 4:13 耶 稣 回 答 说 ， 凡 喝 这 水 的 ， 还 要 再 渴 。
: 4:14 人 若 喝 我 所 赐 的 水 就 永 远 不 渴 。 我 所 赐 的 水 ， 要 在 他 里
: 头 成 为 泉 源 ， 直 涌 到 永 生 。
|
l**********t
发帖数: 5754 | 36
【在 l*****a 的大作中提到】
: 你的永生到手没有？
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 37 没兴趣看
【在 l**********t 的大作中提到】
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 38
again
him,
did
我們在説 starving kids, 你講哪裡去了？ 耶穌餵飽了哪個挨餓的小孩？
耶穌做了什麼？ 證據在哪裡？
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: Jesus did. That's the difference. We talked about the starved children again
: and again, but he is just a talking topic to us. You criticize me with him,
: I also criticize you with him. That's human.
: We are not talking about if Jesus has done his job well, but at least he did
: do it. Not a single human being can do this.
|
h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 39 Amen, our faith is built upon a solid rock.
【在 l**********t 的大作中提到】
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 40
feel so superior, don't you?
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: Amen, our faith is built upon a solid rock.
|
|
|
w******g
发帖数: 10018 | 41 你喂饱哪个小孩了？耶稣至少为我们舍命了，不管如何，你呢？你做了什么？
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: feel so superior, don't you?
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 42
我多少捐過些錢，沒被慈善機構污掉的話，至少有一點用處。
耶穌捨命喂小孩的證據在哪裡？ 捨命以後就沒挨餓小孩了？
你不要把什麼都扯在一起講， 就算耶穌那些傳說是真的，
對挨餓小孩還是沒意義。
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: 你喂饱哪个小孩了？耶稣至少为我们舍命了，不管如何，你呢？你做了什么？
|
t*******d
发帖数: 2570 | 43 No eternal life.
Reason: Second law of thermodynamics.
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: No need for you to prove anything because it's unprovable. Just give your
: reasoning behind. Whatever you have. I will not label you by some cheap
: labels.
: I will give one first:
: Life is so beautiful!
|
w******g
发帖数: 10018 | 44 At least I was moved by Him.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: 我多少捐過些錢，沒被慈善機構污掉的話，至少有一點用處。
: 耶穌捨命喂小孩的證據在哪裡？ 捨命以後就沒挨餓小孩了？
: 你不要把什麼都扯在一起講， 就算耶穌那些傳說是真的，
: 對挨餓小孩還是沒意義。
|
B********0
发帖数: 1153 | 45 相信有永生，因为圣经这样启示。
【在 h******d 的大作中提到】
: No need for you to prove anything because it's unprovable. Just give your
: reasoning behind. Whatever you have. I will not label you by some cheap
: labels.
: I will give one first:
: Life is so beautiful!
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 46
【在 B********0 的大作中提到】
: 相信有永生，因为圣经这样启示。
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 47 证据证据？
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: 你喂饱哪个小孩了？耶稣至少为我们舍命了，不管如何，你呢？你做了什么？
|
w******g
发帖数: 10018 | 48 According to the Bible, as I said before. Because we are talking
about that Jesus in Bible.
【在 l*****a 的大作中提到】
: 证据证据？
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 49 那圣经和现实你怎么分辨？
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: According to the Bible, as I said before. Because we are talking
: about that Jesus in Bible.
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 50 I do not believe they were telling lies.
Things like 前世今生之類的, I am not against it because we just do not know.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
: 前些時候有人貼了一部份。別說我， 你真的相信嗎？
: 你應該知道其他宗教的事蹟更多吧？ 尤其是前世今生之類的。
|
|
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 51 really? have you really finsihed the books?
【在 l*****a 的大作中提到】
: 推荐你看三言二拍，希腊神话，比这个精彩
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 52
know.
Do YOU positively believe those?
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: I do not believe they were telling lies.
: Things like 前世今生之類的, I am not against it because we just do not know.
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 53
to do what?
Many heroes moved many people. Some did good deed and some
did bad. Do you have evidences that Jesus did better than others?
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: At least I was moved by Him.
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 54 Yes, I do. Additionally,I do not believe they were lying.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: to do what?
: Many heroes moved many people. Some did good deed and some
: did bad. Do you have evidences that Jesus did better than others?
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 55
你信前世今生那套？
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: Yes, I do. Additionally,I do not believe they were lying.
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 56 不太相信
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: 你信前世今生那套？
|
B********0
发帖数: 1153 | 57 聪明人转出来，或者说转进去的圈。
其实很简单：
我相信圣经是神的启示，所以相信圣经。如何确定圣经是神的启示？不是因为圣经中“
这是神的话语”的文字，而是出自读圣经的感受。
【在 l*****a 的大作中提到】
: 那圣经和现实你怎么分辨？
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 58 读圣经的感受-〉这是神的话，有啥不同？
承认也好，不承认也好，你们跳不出循环论证的怪圈，你们除了“感受”外根本没有证
据证明你们的神的存在
【在 B********0 的大作中提到】
: 聪明人转出来，或者说转进去的圈。
: 其实很简单：
: 我相信圣经是神的启示，所以相信圣经。如何确定圣经是神的启示？不是因为圣经中“
: 这是神的话语”的文字，而是出自读圣经的感受。
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 59
為什麼信一個不信另一個？ 你認為講前世今生的人說謊？
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: 不太相信
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 60 I am not saying they were lying. I just do believe that much.
If I am telling you I have been touched by the Holy Spirit, would you say I
am lying or you just won't believe me.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: 為什麼信一個不信另一個？ 你認為講前世今生的人說謊？
|
|
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 61
I
我本來就是問句，不是說我認為你説他們說謊。
回到原來的問題，為什麼你信這個不信那個？ 前世今生為什麼對你來說
比較不可信？
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: I am not saying they were lying. I just do believe that much.
: If I am telling you I have been touched by the Holy Spirit, would you say I
: am lying or you just won't believe me.
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 62 I cannot say that I totally disagree on the possiblity of 前世今生
Because there is no such statement of 前世今生 in Christanity, I will not
pay too much attention on that.
I guess your next question will be why you think Christanity is more
convincable than Buddhism.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: I
: 我本來就是問句，不是說我認為你説他們說謊。
: 回到原來的問題，為什麼你信這個不信那個？ 前世今生為什麼對你來說
: 比較不可信？
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 63
Yes, you guessed it right. And some more.
We talked about this because you think heaven or eternal life has
evidences. It looks like you don't care any evidence. Or you only
trust those evidences that support your belief. So, why do we need
to talk about evidences at all? In the end, it's really what you believe,
not what evidences show, right?
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: I cannot say that I totally disagree on the possiblity of 前世今生
: Because there is no such statement of 前世今生 in Christanity, I will not
: pay too much attention on that.
: I guess your next question will be why you think Christanity is more
: convincable than Buddhism.
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 64 what is your definition of evidence? Does that have to be observed by
current scientific methods? or can that be something beyond science, say a
testimony from some people's personal experience?
,
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: Yes, you guessed it right. And some more.
: We talked about this because you think heaven or eternal life has
: evidences. It looks like you don't care any evidence. Or you only
: trust those evidences that support your belief. So, why do we need
: to talk about evidences at all? In the end, it's really what you believe,
: not what evidences show, right?
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 65 不妨用辦案時用的定義， 人證物證都算。
其實我們現在討論的東西用任何定義都一樣， 基督教有的別的宗教都有。
personal experience 也不是不能用，但是不能是只有一個人的經驗而且
完全不能驗證的。 好比兩個互不認識的人，夢到同一件事，連細節都一樣，
那我們就覺得有證據力可以證明他心通之類的科學現在不能解釋的東西。
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: what is your definition of evidence? Does that have to be observed by
: current scientific methods? or can that be something beyond science, say a
: testimony from some people's personal experience?
:
: ,
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 66 There are so many near-death experience reported all over the world.
Many people who have the experience have seen brilliant light and
experienced the ecstatic love from GOD.
Do you agree that this is one of the evidence of the existence of GOD?
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
: 不妨用辦案時用的定義， 人證物證都算。
: 其實我們現在討論的東西用任何定義都一樣， 基督教有的別的宗教都有。
: personal experience 也不是不能用，但是不能是只有一個人的經驗而且
: 完全不能驗證的。 好比兩個互不認識的人，夢到同一件事，連細節都一樣，
: 那我們就覺得有證據力可以證明他心通之類的科學現在不能解釋的東西。
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 67 也有不少看到了佛祖，这是不是证明了佛和极乐世界的存在？
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: There are so many near-death experience reported all over the world.
: Many people who have the experience have seen brilliant light and
: experienced the ecstatic love from GOD.
: Do you agree that this is one of the evidence of the existence of GOD?
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a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 68 two points.
1. spiritual life cannot be proved or disproved by our material reasoning
believing or not is more of personal decision and faith.
2 Budda never claimed his was a GOD.
【在 l*****a 的大作中提到】
: 也有不少看到了佛祖，这是不是证明了佛和极乐世界的存在？
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G******e
发帖数: 9567 | 69 One of the near-death experience truths is that each person integrates their
near-death experience into their own pre-existing belief system
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: There are so many near-death experience reported all over the world.
: Many people who have the experience have seen brilliant light and
: experienced the ecstatic love from GOD.
: Do you agree that this is one of the evidence of the existence of GOD?
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q********1
发帖数: 1521 | 70
笑死人了。按照“圣经”，耶稣事先清清楚楚知道自己一天两夜之后就“俘获”，什么
也不损失，而且还有利益。这样的“舍命”，纯粹是廉价的煽情闹剧。
【在 w******g 的大作中提到】
: 你喂饱哪个小孩了？耶稣至少为我们舍命了，不管如何，你呢？你做了什么？
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q********1
发帖数: 1521 | 71 请楼主思考：
世界上到底有没有“神”/“上帝”？我的回答是：我不知道！原因很简单：人们既没
有证明有“神”，也没有证明没有“神”。
既然人们既没有证明有“神”也没有证明没有“神”，那么，不管是相信“无神论”还
是一般意义上的“有神论”，还是“不可知论”，这都是个人的选择问题。
但是！！！请大家注意，虽然人们没有证明没有“神”，但是我们却可以证明“基督教
的神”不存在。而且，按照“圣经”描写的情节，耶和华/耶稣这个虚构的人物也是极
其邪恶的下流的肮脏的。崇拜耶和华/耶稣这样的东西，是人们良心和理智的自我阉割！ |
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 72
If all (or majority) of NDEs involved the same god, then it can be a
supporting
evidence. But do they? How many Muslims or Buddhists met Jesus in their
NDEs?
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: There are so many near-death experience reported all over the world.
: Many people who have the experience have seen brilliant light and
: experienced the ecstatic love from GOD.
: Do you agree that this is one of the evidence of the existence of GOD?
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a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 73 Some people who did not have any religious belief have had the similar
experience.
their
【在 G******e 的大作中提到】
: One of the near-death experience truths is that each person integrates their
: near-death experience into their own pre-existing belief system
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 74
Any example?
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: Some people who did not have any religious belief have had the similar
: experience.
:
: their
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 75 Based on your early definition of evidence:"
好比兩個互不認識的人，夢到同一件事，連細節都一樣，
那我們就覺得有證據力可以證明他心通之類的科學現在不能解釋的東西。"
Is it reasonable to propose that The existence of spiritual beings?
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: Any example?
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E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 76
It depends on the content of the dream or the NDE.
If it's just warm feeling and seeing white light, that's not enough to
support the existence of spiritual beings, right?
Let's comparing 2 cases.
1. the case of dreaming. If we both dream about something beyond
our experience, and the details match. Then we can say this is something
beyond current science.
2. If we were both choking, then rescued before we die. We both report
feeling hurt, feeling unable to see well, and has some hallucinations. This
is obvious not something strange.
I hope you see what I mean.
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: Based on your early definition of evidence:"
: 好比兩個互不認識的人，夢到同一件事，連細節都一樣，
: 那我們就覺得有證據力可以證明他心通之類的科學現在不能解釋的東西。"
: Is it reasonable to propose that The existence of spiritual beings?
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 77 There are quite a few examples.
the following link provides some information about out of body NDE. The
religious background of many of them are not just mentioned.
http://near-death.com/experiences/research11.html
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: It depends on the content of the dream or the NDE.
: If it's just warm feeling and seeing white light, that's not enough to
: support the existence of spiritual beings, right?
: Let's comparing 2 cases.
: 1. the case of dreaming. If we both dream about something beyond
: our experience, and the details match. Then we can say this is something
: beyond current science.
: 2. If we were both choking, then rescued before we die. We both report
: feeling hurt, feeling unable to see well, and has some hallucinations. This
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 78 1. I am talking about case 1.
2. In http://near-death.com, many of the NDE have been documented. I think at least a majority type of cases reported belong to Case 1 type. Assuming these people were not lying, do you consider their cases are valid based on their descriptions?
This
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: It depends on the content of the dream or the NDE.
: If it's just warm feeling and seeing white light, that's not enough to
: support the existence of spiritual beings, right?
: Let's comparing 2 cases.
: 1. the case of dreaming. If we both dream about something beyond
: our experience, and the details match. Then we can say this is something
: beyond current science.
: 2. If we were both choking, then rescued before we die. We both report
: feeling hurt, feeling unable to see well, and has some hallucinations. This
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 79
That's a long page. Could you narrow a bit, so we can exam the cases?
Pick one case out for discussion.
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: 1. I am talking about case 1.
: 2. In http://near-death.com, many of the NDE have been documented. I think at least a majority type of cases reported belong to Case 1 type. Assuming these people were not lying, do you consider their cases are valid based on their descriptions?
:
: This
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 80 没有某种信仰不表示没接触过某种信仰
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: Some people who did not have any religious belief have had the similar
: experience.
:
: their
|
|
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 81 那换个问法，也有不少看到了佛祖/阿拉/湿婆etc，这是不是说明了佛与极乐世界的存
在和耶和华与天堂的存在和阿拉与天国的存在等等是同样的性质？
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: two points.
: 1. spiritual life cannot be proved or disproved by our material reasoning
: believing or not is more of personal decision and faith.
: 2 Budda never claimed his was a GOD.
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 82 1。在此我主要想说明的是spiritual life存在。
2。关于你的问题，没有人有确切的答案。但是可以从Gensis 1：1 中可以看出些端倪
。"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth"
【在 l*****a 的大作中提到】
: 那换个问法，也有不少看到了佛祖/阿拉/湿婆etc，这是不是说明了佛与极乐世界的存
: 在和耶和华与天堂的存在和阿拉与天国的存在等等是同样的性质？
|
l*****a
发帖数: 38403 | 83 1，看到了佛祖和极乐世界是不是说明有spiritual life存在？ 顺便问下什么是
spiritual life
2，盘古大帝的创世说得更好，更详细，你说神和盘古什么关系？
天地渾沌如雞子。盤古生在其中。萬八千歲。天地開闢。陽清為天。陰濁為地。盤古在
其中。一日九變。神於天。聖於地。天日高一丈。地日厚一丈。盤古日長一丈。如此萬
八千歲。天數極高。地數極深。盤古極長。故天去地九萬里。後乃有三皇。
天氣蒙鴻，萌芽茲始，遂分天地，肇立乾坤，啟陰感陽，分佈元氣，乃孕中和，是為人
也。首生盤古。垂死化身。氣成風雲。聲為雷霆。左眼為日。右眼為月。四肢五體為四
極五嶽。血液為江河。筋脈為地裏。肌肉為田土。髮為星辰。皮膚為草木。齒骨為金石
。精髓為珠玉。汗流為雨澤。身之諸蟲。因風所感。化為黎甿。
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: 1。在此我主要想说明的是spiritual life存在。
: 2。关于你的问题，没有人有确切的答案。但是可以从Gensis 1：1 中可以看出些端倪
: 。"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth"
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h******d
发帖数: 1891 | 84 Grace09 believes the existence of spirit.
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: 1。在此我主要想说明的是spiritual life存在。
: 2。关于你的问题，没有人有确切的答案。但是可以从Gensis 1：1 中可以看出些端倪
: 。"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth"
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 85 1. 我的理解是人以非肉体的形式存在，是不会毁灭的。
2。我对盘古不了解。
【在 l*****a 的大作中提到】
: 1，看到了佛祖和极乐世界是不是说明有spiritual life存在？ 顺便问下什么是
: spiritual life
: 2，盘古大帝的创世说得更好，更详细，你说神和盘古什么关系？
: 天地渾沌如雞子。盤古生在其中。萬八千歲。天地開闢。陽清為天。陰濁為地。盤古在
: 其中。一日九變。神於天。聖於地。天日高一丈。地日厚一丈。盤古日長一丈。如此萬
: 八千歲。天數極高。地數極深。盤古極長。故天去地九萬里。後乃有三皇。
: 天氣蒙鴻，萌芽茲始，遂分天地，肇立乾坤，啟陰感陽，分佈元氣，乃孕中和，是為人
: 也。首生盤古。垂死化身。氣成風雲。聲為雷霆。左眼為日。右眼為月。四肢五體為四
: 極五嶽。血液為江河。筋脈為地裏。肌肉為田土。髮為星辰。皮膚為草木。齒骨為金石
: 。精髓為珠玉。汗流為雨澤。身之諸蟲。因風所感。化為黎甿。
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a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 86 I am not the witness, so I can not give a you a detailed accounts of what
exactly happened, in case you want to dig out more information.
Here are the common elelments in NDE,
see http://www.near-death.com/experiences/evidence06.html
"Just to list a few of them"
A. Visualizing or experiencing being apart from the physical body, perhaps
with the ability to change locations.
B. Greatly enhanced cognition (thoughts very clear, rapid, and hyper-lucid
).
C. A darkness or light that is perceived as alive and intelligent and
powerful.
The questions for you are. 1. do you believe they were lying? 2. If not, do
you believe they have clear-minds when they recall their experiences?
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
:
: That's a long page. Could you narrow a bit, so we can exam the cases?
: Pick one case out for discussion.
|
E*****m
发帖数: 25615 | 87 你說的這些不太奇怪，可能腦部缺氧的症狀就是這樣， 如果他們
在那時看到同樣的情節，或者看到他們不可能知道的事情，那可能
算是證據。
我看過有描述靈魂離體看到搶救室外面的情況， 如果是可以驗證，
算是證據。
你自己學科學的，你應該清楚什麼樣的東西有證據力，可以用來支持
一個假說或理論。
perhaps
lucid
【在 a**********e 的大作中提到】
: I am not the witness, so I can not give a you a detailed accounts of what
: exactly happened, in case you want to dig out more information.
: Here are the common elelments in NDE,
: see http://www.near-death.com/experiences/evidence06.html
: "Just to list a few of them"
: A. Visualizing or experiencing being apart from the physical body, perhaps
: with the ability to change locations.
: B. Greatly enhanced cognition (thoughts very clear, rapid, and hyper-lucid
: ).
: C. A darkness or light that is perceived as alive and intelligent and
|
a**********e
发帖数: 418 | 88 The following are some examples of veridical NDEs documented by Moody:
Example 1: An elderly woman had been blind since childhood. But, during
her NDE, the woman had regained her sight and she was able to accurately
describe the instruments and techniques used during the resuscitation her
body. After the woman was revived, she reported the details to her doctor.
She was able to tell her doctor who came in and out, what they said, what
they wore, what they did, all of which was true. Her doctor then referred
the woman to Moody who he knew was doing research at the time on NDEs.
Example 2: One patient told Moody, After it was all over the doctor told
me that I had a really bad time, and I said, Yeah, I know.' He said, Well,
how do you know?' and I said, I can tell you everything that happened.' He
didn't believe me, so I told him the whole story, from the time I stopped
breathing until the time I was kind of coming around. He was really shocked
to know that I knew everything that had happened. He didn't know quite what
to say, but he came in several times to ask me different things about it.
Example 3: In another instance a woman with a heart condition was dying at
the same time that her sister was in a diabetic coma in another part of the
same hospital. The subject reported having a conversation with her sister
as both of them hovered near the ceiling watching the medical team work on
her body below. When the woman awoke, she told the doctor that her sister
had died while her own resuscitation was taking place. The doctor denied it,
but when she insisted, he had a nurse check on it. The sister had, in fact,
died during the time in question.
【在 E*****m 的大作中提到】
: 你說的這些不太奇怪，可能腦部缺氧的症狀就是這樣， 如果他們
: 在那時看到同樣的情節，或者看到他們不可能知道的事情，那可能
: 算是證據。
: 我看過有描述靈魂離體看到搶救室外面的情況， 如果是可以驗證，
: 算是證據。
: 你自己學科學的，你應該清楚什麼樣的東西有證據力，可以用來支持
: 一個假說或理論。
:
: perhaps
: lucid
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