W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 1 某大神曾经说过，"you should have a bluff range on every decision." preflop
cold 4 bet 也是， best hand to 4 bet is probably a hand with a blocker like
Axs or even total trash at the right spot.
Merge $100.00 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players -
MP1: $100.65
MP2: $248.67
CO: $282.33
BTN: $97.00
SB: $143.83
Hero (BB): $100.00
UTG: $96.34
UTG+1: $100.00
Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is BB with X X
5 folds, BTN raises to $3, SB raises to $8.25, Hero raises to $23, BTN
raises to $97, SB fold. HERO?
这里button vpip 16/11/5, button raise 39%， fold to 3 bet 50%, 4 bet range
1.6%
sb is 18/15/6.8, sb 3 bet 8%
hero image seems irrelavent, obvious do not cold 4 bet often or ever, but
usually running 20/14/5 on FR.
Note this is a full ring game. so stats look much tighter than 6max or HU.
what is the correct calling range here? | W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 2 my instant reaction to button's 5 shove here is "wow, that is awefully
strong move". what is his reasonable shove range here? | d*****0
发帖数: 1500 | 3 大哥 一定要赢下这个pot么 瀑布汗呐 即使你这把call对了 长期来讲也不一定是个+ev
的call啊，对手5bet shove mix适当的trash hand的还是非常reasonable的，plus你的
很少的cold 4bet，你就一定要抓住他的这个可能1/5或者1/6甚至更低的bluffing
range么。
再一次，瀑布汗呐
除非。。。当时有特别的table dynamic。。。 | p******a
发帖数: 975 | 4 Given the read you have and the pot odds you get, I think you know the
answer already. | W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 5 你不是问我cold 4 bet 没有commit 吗？。所以我就贴出来了咯。 我是KQo. D 神觉
得也是fold 哈？ 那calling range 是啥呢？ QQ+ or even tighter？ 不要躲躲闪闪
不回答呀。
ev
★ 发自iPhone App: ChineseWeb 7.8
【在 d*****0 的大作中提到】
: 大哥 一定要赢下这个pot么 瀑布汗呐 即使你这把call对了 长期来讲也不一定是个+ev
: 的call啊，对手5bet shove mix适当的trash hand的还是非常reasonable的，plus你的
: 很少的cold 4bet，你就一定要抓住他的这个可能1/5或者1/6甚至更低的bluffing
: range么。
: 再一次，瀑布汗呐
: 除非。。。当时有特别的table dynamic。。。
| d*****0
发帖数: 1500 | 6 用哥的神器算出 kqo对上qq+/AKs是 18比82，加上少量的bluffing hand（这尼玛谁
bluff cold 4bettor啊）就算降到25比75，尼玛，你要用74刀去赢这个129刀的pot，你
是EV大神，你懂的。
再退一步，就算对手的range里1/3是AX（神donk），对上他的bluffing range，你也没
有抢回多少equity啊。
你应该没有call吧，你的blocker完全不顶用啊，呵呵。 | M********g
发帖数: 717 | 7 感觉这个情况的确蛮难过的。
kq可以惩罚bottom open和sb raise,但是面对shove, 这个stack size有点难受。
这个情况高手么有什么想法呢。
【在 W********m 的大作中提到】
: 你不是问我cold 4 bet 没有commit 吗？。所以我就贴出来了咯。 我是KQo. D 神觉
: 得也是fold 哈？ 那calling range 是啥呢？ QQ+ or even tighter？ 不要躲躲闪闪
: 不回答呀。
:
: ev
: ★ 发自iPhone App: ChineseWeb 7.8
| T*********k
发帖数: 1621 | 8 I thought you guys are playing high stake $400 - $800 games. Then I read
the posts again and realize it is just 0.5 - 1 dollars game.
I see ppl lose a big chunk of stacks all the time in SB, BB, Btn position
playing the steal, re-steal and re-re-steal game. In tournament, I can
understand, but just feel it is so unnecessary in cash game.
Never understand why ppl try to make things so complicated for a simple game
. Holding KQo facing a 5 bet, and players are still thinking their brain out
about table image, position, EV, ranges, 4 bet range, VPIP, PRF... etc.etc.
, When that happens, it is not a normal poker game any more, it becomes an
ego game. The money is no longer important, "I just try to outplay you, out
think you" becomes the top priority.
Not saying I won't do it myself here and there, but every time I am in that
type of situation, I always wonder to myself "how in the world I put myself
in that place?" | d*****0
发帖数: 1500 | 9 最近desktop的硬盘坏了 连着哥的脑子也有点秀逗了 没看明白mm老湿的问题。
下面郑重回答，mm老湿问的，拿什么来call这个btn的5bet
在abc情况下，100bb有效stack，鉴于btn是5bet 未知的cold 4 bettor，
online
微级别桌子，哥愿意把他的range估计在qq+／AK和极少的bluffing hands，这里哥的
calling range和对手的shoving range相同，另外，哥一般不用qq和ak在这里small
4bet，哥会either flat，或者直接4bet shove，从而避免拿qq和ak在这里crying call，
低级别桌子（nl50/nl100），一般或者未知对手，哥会把他放在KK＋和少量QQ，哥的
calling range是KK＋。另外，哥想了一下，一般情况下，哥只在这里用qq cold 4bet
small／fold，用KK＋/ak flat，fold其他的牌。遇到明显的好的spot，可能拿着any 2
cold 4bet／fold，拿着kk＋ 4bet/commit。
再高级别的桌子，木有经验，weaktight哟～～～
live 1/2,几乎只拿KK＋ 4bet/commit，爱谁谁
live 2/5,和online低级别相同策略 | q****8
发帖数: 3281 | 10 Good point!
game
out
etc.
out
【在 T*********k 的大作中提到】
: I thought you guys are playing high stake $400 - $800 games. Then I read
: the posts again and realize it is just 0.5 - 1 dollars game.
: I see ppl lose a big chunk of stacks all the time in SB, BB, Btn position
: playing the steal, re-steal and re-re-steal game. In tournament, I can
: understand, but just feel it is so unnecessary in cash game.
: Never understand why ppl try to make things so complicated for a simple game
: . Holding KQo facing a 5 bet, and players are still thinking their brain out
: about table image, position, EV, ranges, 4 bet range, VPIP, PRF... etc.etc.
: , When that happens, it is not a normal poker game any more, it becomes an
: ego game. The money is no longer important, "I just try to outplay you, out
| f*****g
发帖数: 15860 | 11 exactly, outsmart someone, it feels good, right? tons of players, fish or
shark, love to show their "intelligence" to the table.
game
out
etc.
out
【在 T*********k 的大作中提到】
: I thought you guys are playing high stake $400 - $800 games. Then I read
: the posts again and realize it is just 0.5 - 1 dollars game.
: I see ppl lose a big chunk of stacks all the time in SB, BB, Btn position
: playing the steal, re-steal and re-re-steal game. In tournament, I can
: understand, but just feel it is so unnecessary in cash game.
: Never understand why ppl try to make things so complicated for a simple game
: . Holding KQo facing a 5 bet, and players are still thinking their brain out
: about table image, position, EV, ranges, 4 bet range, VPIP, PRF... etc.etc.
: , When that happens, it is not a normal poker game any more, it becomes an
: ego game. The money is no longer important, "I just try to outplay you, out
| W********m
发帖数: 7793 | 12 看来以前被我最佩服的大神骗了。
还是班上的真大神讲得有道理。 学习了。 打牌根本不需要bluff range. 打大牌，
打nuts， 冲着鱼打就行了。有厉害的reg 躲着点就行了。 以后下面这种打发要不得
。 这里的villian 就是那SB。 这SB 我原来觉得丫是carbon NL100 里打得比较好的
reg 之一。哥知道丫的5 bet range 里有K8s 的bluff... 现在众大神一解释发现丫原
来 what a fish! 哈哈。。
Merge $50.00 No Limit Hold'em - 8 players -
SB: $112.82
BB: $53.78
UTG: $62.18
Hero (UTG+1): $58.06
MP1: $50.00
MP2: $31.03
CO: $40.84
BTN: $51.85
Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is UTG+1 with 6d 6h
1 fold, Hero raises to $1.50, 5 folds, BB raises to $4.50, Hero calls $3
Flop: ($9.25) 9d 8c 7d (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $5.00, BB raises to $14.50, Hero raises to $53.56, BB
calls $34.78 all in
Turn: ($107.81) Ad (2 players - 1 is all in)
River: ($107.81) Ac (2 players - 1 is all in)
Final Pot: $107.81
BB shows Kd Ts
Hero shows 6d 6h
Hero wins $100.28
Hero wins $4.28
(Rake: $3.25) |
|
