d****i
发帖数: 4809 | 1 如果用VC++的话，还是MFC的库吗？还是有什么新的更好用的库？ | S**I
发帖数: 15689 | 2 you can use Qt
【在 d****i 的大作中提到】
: 如果用VC++的话，还是MFC的库吗？还是有什么新的更好用的库？
| L***n
发帖数: 6727 | 3 or WinForm?
【在 S**I 的大作中提到】
: you can use Qt
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 4 Just don't use C++, use C#. Why bother with C++. C# can seamlessly work with
C++
.
【在 d****i 的大作中提到】
: 如果用VC++的话，还是MFC的库吗？还是有什么新的更好用的库？
| d****i
发帖数: 4809 | 5 谢谢，Qt可以在Visual Studio里面直接用吗？
【在 S**I 的大作中提到】
: you can use Qt
| S**I
发帖数: 15689 | 6 yes, check this:
http://qt.nokia.com/products/platform/qt-for-windows
【在 d****i 的大作中提到】
: 谢谢，Qt可以在Visual Studio里面直接用吗？
| P********e
发帖数: 2610 | 7 写windows用qt的优势是什么啊
【在 S**I 的大作中提到】
: yes, check this:
: http://qt.nokia.com/products/platform/qt-for-windows
| l******e
发帖数: 12192 | 8 portable
【在 P********e 的大作中提到】
: 写windows用qt的优势是什么啊
| P********e
发帖数: 2610 | 9 vs里面可以编译出linux运行文件?
【在 l******e 的大作中提到】
: portable
| l******e
发帖数: 12192 | 10 The source code is portable.
【在 P********e 的大作中提到】
: vs里面可以编译出linux运行文件?
| | | D*******a
发帖数: 3688 | 11 most windows code need major non-trivial tweaking before they can be
compiled in linux/unix. why bother.
【在 l******e 的大作中提到】
: The source code is portable.
| S**I
发帖数: 15689 | 12 VS 2010 seems to be more consistent with GCC.
【在 D*******a 的大作中提到】
: most windows code need major non-trivial tweaking before they can be
: compiled in linux/unix. why bother.
| l******e
发帖数: 12192 | 13 not true. hehe
and for GUI, if with MS, it's not just non-trivial tweaking.
【在 D*******a 的大作中提到】
: most windows code need major non-trivial tweaking before they can be
: compiled in linux/unix. why bother.
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 14 If I develop with Windows, I wouldn't worry about other platform. You have
most users already anyway. Especially GUI.
【在 l******e 的大作中提到】
: not true. hehe
: and for GUI, if with MS, it's not just non-trivial tweaking.
| l******e
发帖数: 12192 | 15 it depends.
sometimes, you may change your mind later.
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: If I develop with Windows, I wouldn't worry about other platform. You have
: most users already anyway. Especially GUI.
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 16 Windows is a platform too narrow (technically). It has its own version of
everything. In the past, we always develop on Linux and maintain
compatibility
to Windows and Mac. Those applications were not even GUI program, we had to
use many #define.
Now I use Mac at home, Linux at work. Mac is a even worse system for
developing platform-independent applications.
【在 l******e 的大作中提到】
: it depends.
: sometimes, you may change your mind later.
| D*******a
发帖数: 3688 | 17 right
it makes no economic sense to develop multi-platform program without
consulting the market. If there is a need perhaps Java is a better choice.
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: If I develop with Windows, I wouldn't worry about other platform. You have
: most users already anyway. Especially GUI.
| o****e
发帖数: 916 | 18 try .net, c#?
set target framework to 2.0, then the code is portable to linux as well,
with mono support (try not to use win api) | L***n
发帖数: 6727 | 19 I think C#/Mono is pretty good, you even have binary
compatibility in theory. May not be perfect but if I
want to develop a GUI application that can run on both
linux and windoz, I'll pick C# as my choice, plus C#
is a pretty neat language.
【在 D*******a 的大作中提到】
: most windows code need major non-trivial tweaking before they can be
: compiled in linux/unix. why bother.
| r****y
发帖数: 26819 | 20 then why not java?
【在 L***n 的大作中提到】
: I think C#/Mono is pretty good, you even have binary
: compatibility in theory. May not be perfect but if I
: want to develop a GUI application that can run on both
: linux and windoz, I'll pick C# as my choice, plus C#
: is a pretty neat language.
| | | r*******n
发帖数: 3020 | 21 I think using c++ to develop GUI is torture. so if you
want to try a new language, I recommend Python and wxPython or
Python and PyQT, which both are cross-platform.
The attached is what I made in Python and wxPython and pyOpenGL
【在 d****i 的大作中提到】
: 如果用VC++的话，还是MFC的库吗？还是有什么新的更好用的库？
| N***m
发帖数: 4460 | 22 哇，看着很不错也。不过大部分情况下应该是项目经理决定用啥语言吧。
【在 r*******n 的大作中提到】
: I think using c++ to develop GUI is torture. so if you
: want to try a new language, I recommend Python and wxPython or
: Python and PyQT, which both are cross-platform.
: The attached is what I made in Python and wxPython and pyOpenGL
| L***n
发帖数: 6727 | 23 because .Net is native on Windoz, Java is not, and, this is
personal, I always hate Swing's GUI... looks alien on
either linux or windoz
【在 r****y 的大作中提到】
: then why not java?
| r*******n
发帖数: 3020 | 24 I have the same feeling about Swing.
【在 L***n 的大作中提到】
: because .Net is native on Windoz, Java is not, and, this is
: personal, I always hate Swing's GUI... looks alien on
: either linux or windoz
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 25 agree. C# works very well with C++ back.
【在 L***n 的大作中提到】
: because .Net is native on Windoz, Java is not, and, this is
: personal, I always hate Swing's GUI... looks alien on
: either linux or windoz
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 26 It really depends what is the task. If you have a C++ application,
and you need to develop GUI for this application, C#.
If you have to develop a whole new application, it doesn't matter
which language you use. Python is okay for in house application.
【在 r*******n 的大作中提到】
: I think using c++ to develop GUI is torture. so if you
: want to try a new language, I recommend Python and wxPython or
: Python and PyQT, which both are cross-platform.
: The attached is what I made in Python and wxPython and pyOpenGL
| r*******n
发帖数: 3020 | 27 It's easy to write C\C++ extensions to Python,
actually, wxPython is a wrapper of wxWidgets written in C++.
So if you develop GUI for C\C++ applications, Python works great, too.
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: It really depends what is the task. If you have a C++ application,
: and you need to develop GUI for this application, C#.
: If you have to develop a whole new application, it doesn't matter
: which language you use. Python is okay for in house application.
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 28 come on, seriously? SWIG? Boost.Python? ctype?
I did Python interface for our engine, and used C#. I wouldn't say Python
works great.
【在 r*******n 的大作中提到】
: It's easy to write C\C++ extensions to Python,
: actually, wxPython is a wrapper of wxWidgets written in C++.
: So if you develop GUI for C\C++ applications, Python works great, too.
| r*******n
发帖数: 3020 | 29 I don't use C# and have no idea how easily C# work with C++ compared to
Python.
You think any of SWIG, Boost.Python and ctype are not good?
Could you point something out?
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: come on, seriously? SWIG? Boost.Python? ctype?
: I did Python interface for our engine, and used C#. I wouldn't say Python
: works great.
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 30 If you haven't used other tools to interface with C++, then there is no
point to argue.
I know many people use SWIG and there are many projects. The wrapper code is
ugly and there are pitfalls you may have to tweak it. ctype doesn't have
good
C++ support, and it needs a lot coding. Boost.Python is the one I haven't
used. It is said to be good but will need more coding.
You don't have to use a language for everything. I know Python is good, I
use it everyday. But I do use Perl, Bash, C/C++ as well. I am not saying
Python can't do GUI, but I doubt it is a good way in LZ's case. If you are
doing in-house application or linux freewares, it could be enough.
Although I find SWIG dangerous and ugly, some people may find it very good.
【在 r*******n 的大作中提到】
: I don't use C# and have no idea how easily C# work with C++ compared to
: Python.
: You think any of SWIG, Boost.Python and ctype are not good?
: Could you point something out?
| | | T*********g
发帖数: 496 | 31 MFC现在比较少人用了。
QT和wxwidget很红。 尤其是QT。
但是QT的界面并非原生系统的，有时候看起来有点怪怪的。
【在 d****i 的大作中提到】
: 如果用VC++的话，还是MFC的库吗？还是有什么新的更好用的库？
| r*******n
发帖数: 3020 | 32 But you didn't say anything about how beautiful c++ in C# is, which is what
I really want to know. Clearly, I didn't meant to argue that C# is not good.
Python is my favorite programming language, but I never expect one language
to do
everything, but given the circumstances, choose the languages that fit the
needs.
Anyway, what case do you know lz has, and you doubt Python is a good choice.
On MS windows, I agree C# for GUI is very good choice, but You still have a
another
choice.
is
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: If you haven't used other tools to interface with C++, then there is no
: point to argue.
: I know many people use SWIG and there are many projects. The wrapper code is
: ugly and there are pitfalls you may have to tweak it. ctype doesn't have
: good
: C++ support, and it needs a lot coding. Boost.Python is the one I haven't
: used. It is said to be good but will need more coding.
: You don't have to use a language for everything. I know Python is good, I
: use it everyday. But I do use Perl, Bash, C/C++ as well. I am not saying
: Python can't do GUI, but I doubt it is a good way in LZ's case. If you are
| N***m
发帖数: 4460 | 33 python是不错的，我学过我用过，比C#不差
what
good.
language
choice.
a
【在 r*******n 的大作中提到】
: But you didn't say anything about how beautiful c++ in C# is, which is what
: I really want to know. Clearly, I didn't meant to argue that C# is not good.
: Python is my favorite programming language, but I never expect one language
: to do
: everything, but given the circumstances, choose the languages that fit the
: needs.
: Anyway, what case do you know lz has, and you doubt Python is a good choice.
: On MS windows, I agree C# for GUI is very good choice, but You still have a
: another
: choice.
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 34 Okay, your question was why I don't think Python is good enough. As I said,
it
is okay for a in-house application. Ask yourself what application you have
developed in Python. In C#, it is similar to ctype in Python, without the
parameter problem you normally have with ctype (conversion). Just declare
the
function in C# and then you have it.
This how I see these languages:
C, C++ - for people like puzzel games and the game of creating bugs and fix
later
Java, C# - get job done, platform free because he doesn't care about
platform at all (hence no concern of memory, speed, cache)
Python, Perl, Ruby - small projects, web applications, interfacing with
libraries and you don't actually need to know much
I like Python too, but I think the beauty of Python is not to have to use
Python to do anything. It is good because of all those packages written in
C/C++/Fortran. pyWebkit is good. Maybe UI should really use JavaScript. The
only problem is that I don't see it as a commercial language and a language
for big projects( I am not saying there are no big Python projects around.
Also, C# is easier to interface C++, because you only need to compile the
library itself. especially you are in windows, and you probably use vs to
compile C++.
I am sorry if you have different opinion on this. I am not expert either, so
.
You can talk about the good experience you have with Python GUI, or Python
for
desktop application.
what
good.
language
choice.
a
【在 r*******n 的大作中提到】
: But you didn't say anything about how beautiful c++ in C# is, which is what
: I really want to know. Clearly, I didn't meant to argue that C# is not good.
: Python is my favorite programming language, but I never expect one language
: to do
: everything, but given the circumstances, choose the languages that fit the
: needs.
: Anyway, what case do you know lz has, and you doubt Python is a good choice.
: On MS windows, I agree C# for GUI is very good choice, but You still have a
: another
: choice.
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 35 the point is not which language is good. Exact which part of Python is
better
than C#? How can you draw the conclusion without any context? Do you mean it
is easy to use? easy to read?
【在 N***m 的大作中提到】
: python是不错的，我学过我用过，比C#不差
:
: what
: good.
: language
: choice.
: a
| L***n
发帖数: 6727 | 36 Also the speed is one big factor, I think python is in no way comparable
to C# in terms of performance. If you have kinda big project, that's
important
too.
,
fix
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: Okay, your question was why I don't think Python is good enough. As I said,
: it
: is okay for a in-house application. Ask yourself what application you have
: developed in Python. In C#, it is similar to ctype in Python, without the
: parameter problem you normally have with ctype (conversion). Just declare
: the
: function in C# and then you have it.
: This how I see these languages:
: C, C++ - for people like puzzel games and the game of creating bugs and fix
: later
| N***m
发帖数: 4460 | 37 我是说不过你的，我搬小板凳
it
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: the point is not which language is good. Exact which part of Python is
: better
: than C#? How can you draw the conclusion without any context? Do you mean it
: is easy to use? easy to read?
| e****d
发帖数: 895 | 38 Why does people always claim C/C++ is for puzzle games and bugs? I don't
see this kind of claims for other languages.
,
fix
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: Okay, your question was why I don't think Python is good enough. As I said,
: it
: is okay for a in-house application. Ask yourself what application you have
: developed in Python. In C#, it is similar to ctype in Python, without the
: parameter problem you normally have with ctype (conversion). Just declare
: the
: function in C# and then you have it.
: This how I see these languages:
: C, C++ - for people like puzzel games and the game of creating bugs and fix
: later
| N***m
发帖数: 4460 | 39 agree, c++ is over designed.
【在 e****d 的大作中提到】
: Why does people always claim C/C++ is for puzzle games and bugs? I don't
: see this kind of claims for other languages.
:
: ,
: fix
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 40 Mainly it is because of the memory management, boundary checking and such.
memory leak is the most common bug in C/C++ programs. Also there are
pitfalls
in C++ to do with the design of the langauge. Sometimes it is not very
obvious.
languages as Java have some additional safety features and they are actually
safer than C++. C is not as complicated as C++. Of course, C/C++ still are
closer to the platform. You can re-arrange structure and see performance
gain
in your program. Performance wise, C++ is still very good.
【在 e****d 的大作中提到】
: Why does people always claim C/C++ is for puzzle games and bugs? I don't
: see this kind of claims for other languages.
:
: ,
: fix
| | | e****d
发帖数: 895 | 41 Java applications usually eat up more memory than C++ applications though
because lots of Java programmers don't pay much attention of memory usage.
By carefully using proper memory pool/allocators/smart pointers, the chance
of memory leak in C++ can be greatly reduced although some tricky conditions
such as unexpected exceptions can still cause memory leaks if they are not
properly handled.
actually
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: Mainly it is because of the memory management, boundary checking and such.
: memory leak is the most common bug in C/C++ programs. Also there are
: pitfalls
: in C++ to do with the design of the langauge. Sometimes it is not very
: obvious.
: languages as Java have some additional safety features and they are actually
: safer than C++. C is not as complicated as C++. Of course, C/C++ still are
: closer to the platform. You can re-arrange structure and see performance
: gain
: in your program. Performance wise, C++ is still very good.
| r*******n
发帖数: 3020 | 42 Quote :
I like Python too, but I think the beauty of Python is not to have to use
Python to do anything. It is good because of all those packages written in
C/C++/Fortran.
No offence!
If you think the beauty of Python is not have to use Python to
do anything, I don't think you get the points of Python(For me, Python is
dynamic, concise and productive).
You said "It is good because of all those packages written in
C/C++/Fortran.", which doesn't tell Python works great with C/C++?
If it' so, that's a great feature.
For GUI applications, I switched from Visual C++ MFC to Python wxPython,
it was five years ago, since then I never want to go back VC++ MFC, but
sometime I had to. Now MFC was dumped by MS, yes, it was not the first
time, do you remember Visual J++? And Ms murdered Borland, they got
Anders Hejlsberg who was the leader of new platform .net and c#.
Finally, MS played catch-up.
I have good experience with wxPython that have good documents and tons of
samples. The size of project I'm working on is over 7,000 lines of Python
code,
and it's still growing, and it works so far so good. I knew lines of code
cannot
exactly measure how big the project is, but it can be able to tell something.
The bad experience I had is about multi-threading in Python. Most of cases
it
work, but in my situation, I needed one thread to listen serial port(RS232)
all the time,
through which there were a lot of bits coming in, to reduce noises and
decode them in
terms of protocol, and then send them to GUI application. Those made the
GUI run
slowly. It turned out I knew it's GIL(Global Interpreter Lock) caused this
problem. So I
split them out, they ran their own interpreters respectively. Problem solved
! but it's not
beautiful.
,
fix | b******n
发帖数: 592 | 43 If I understood correctly, you are using Python in a lab, right? That's only
kind of argument I was trying to make. I know there are Python interfaces of
almost all packages, and it doesn't say Python works great with C/C++, to be
honest. I didn't say you can't do it in Python. On the contratry, I
mentioned
a few times you can do if you are developing in house applications. In this
particular case, C# GUI may be a better choice for LZ. I am not against
wxPython
wxWindow wouldnt be one of my choice either. There is not much to argue as
long as you are using Python to do GUI in a lab.
【在 r*******n 的大作中提到】
: Quote :
: I like Python too, but I think the beauty of Python is not to have to use
: Python to do anything. It is good because of all those packages written in
: C/C++/Fortran.
: No offence!
: If you think the beauty of Python is not have to use Python to
: do anything, I don't think you get the points of Python(For me, Python is
: dynamic, concise and productive).
: You said "It is good because of all those packages written in
: C/C++/Fortran.", which doesn't tell Python works great with C/C++?
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 44 btw, Python is one of my favrouite programming language as well. I use it
many times to process data, use scipy and R.
only
of
be
this
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: If I understood correctly, you are using Python in a lab, right? That's only
: kind of argument I was trying to make. I know there are Python interfaces of
: almost all packages, and it doesn't say Python works great with C/C++, to be
: honest. I didn't say you can't do it in Python. On the contratry, I
: mentioned
: a few times you can do if you are developing in house applications. In this
: particular case, C# GUI may be a better choice for LZ. I am not against
: wxPython
: wxWindow wouldnt be one of my choice either. There is not much to argue as
: long as you are using Python to do GUI in a lab.
| r*******n
发帖数: 3020 | 45 Ye, you are right, I'm using Python in a lab. What if I use C# in house
application? Can I
argue C# is a great language for GUI or for anything else?
And I really made software in Python + wxPython when I worked in China ,
but size of
which was smaller than that of what I'm working on, so I didn't mention it.
What differences between commercial software and in house application? I
think the
critical one is robustness, and how to make it, test and test!
There are a lot of debates that whether Python can handle large projects or
not.
The major argument is actually Dynamic vs Static. Dynamic is much flexible,
if don't
use it in a proper way, that's gonna cause problems, in which situation,
compiler of
Python cannot help you to avoid this while static languages can.
I believe Python is good enough to do GUI. wxPython and PyQt both are mature
libs,
if the parts of your project are computing-intensive , use C\C++ to extend
Python to
gain the performance or another way. Python is a trend.
I know there are Python interfaces of
be
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
almost all packages written in C\C++ are working under the hood, you still
don't think
python work great with C\C++. what is ' WORK GREAT' in your view?
it's not beautiful or not easy to do?
Anyway, To define interfaces using PyObject * bla bla..., I don't think it's
complex, it
looks like to define abstract class as interface.
【在 b******n 的大作中提到】
: btw, Python is one of my favrouite programming language as well. I use it
: many times to process data, use scipy and R.
:
: only
: of
: be
: this
| b******n
发帖数: 592 | 46 Python may take over the world. It is trendy, I agree. My company current
use
Python to prototype the product in research environment, and then we have
software engineer to develop the actual product in C++.
The advantage of Python is its ease of use. So the researchers don't have to
spend too much time on software development. Maybe it is just the perception
of software industry that none of the company is giving up Java, C, C++, C#
for Python. Tomorrow it maybe the only language every one use. It is okay
for
you to use Python for everything. It is just not for me. I don't know why
you
get so upset when I think Python + wxPython can't do commercial job. I just
don't see many commercial stuffs around. I am not saying C# is the only good
language for GUI, but I do think it works better with C++ in Windows. Do you
really have experience with SWIG on Windows? I will stick to my opinion that
Windows is Microsoft's world, and you better play it nicely.
Python sucks (just to test if you jump out of couch and fall off)..sorry
it.
or
【在 r*******n 的大作中提到】
: Ye, you are right, I'm using Python in a lab. What if I use C# in house
: application? Can I
: argue C# is a great language for GUI or for anything else?
: And I really made software in Python + wxPython when I worked in China ,
: but size of
: which was smaller than that of what I'm working on, so I didn't mention it.
: What differences between commercial software and in house application? I
: think the
: critical one is robustness, and how to make it, test and test!
: There are a lot of debates that whether Python can handle large projects or
| k******r
发帖数: 2300 | 47 Win32 API is good enough.
【在 d****i 的大作中提到】
: 如果用VC++的话，还是MFC的库吗？还是有什么新的更好用的库？
|
|
