v*******e
发帖数: 11604 | 1 【 以下文字转载自 Military 讨论区 】
发信人: fighter644 (武士), 信区: Military
标 题: 好消息，我挺梁警官的评论成了纽约时报编辑pick的评论了
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Mon Feb 23 22:31:57 2015, 美东)
首先，祝贺大家的努力，华人的大签名活动以及各种抗议已经得到主流的注意，今天的
纽约时报发表文章专门说“梁警官事件华人社区分离的看法”，貌似很客观地报道了一
下华人的主流意见，而且允许评论。
400多评论，大多数认为梁警官是被当作了替罪羊。这不仅仅是我的观察，有人看了评
论也总结了：A lot of these comments are depressing with most viewing this
situation through the lenses of whatever ethnic group they belong to with
most of the sympathy going to the police officer because people think he is
the hapless victim of scapegoating due to his ethnicity or the difficulty
inherent in his job. There is relatively little sympathy going to Mr. Gurley
, who is after all, dead. What about his parents and young daughter?
然后我也去发了评论，没想到成了纽约时报编辑的14个pick之一，可见纽约时报有的编
辑还是有一定的同情的。然后我的评论后又一个很不错的黑人回复，非常聪明的黑人，
试图与华人社区沟通交好。我也回复了。如下。
我的评论：
What really angers the Chinese community is the inequality of criminal
justice. If the law is not “similarly situated, similarly treated”, then
it is not law. Then we have to be outraged. If the White officers who
committed much more egregious intended killings like in Garner’s case get
life time in prison sentence, then we would view the indictment of Liang’s
unintended accidental killing as justifiable. If the White officer who
accidentally shot an unarmed civilian dead when patrolling a NY’s housing
project in 2004 got indicted, then we would view the indictment of Liang as
justified. This is a most similar case to that of Liang. But no, they are
never indicted. So Liang is the only one singled out. Except that he is
Asian, what else can be the reason? He is made a scapegoat for those
officers because he is Asian. This is not law, but racism in criminal
justice.
黑人回复
We have common cause. Both our communities have common cause and reason to
unite our voices.
As an African-American, my heart not only goes out to the family of Akai
Gurley, but the family of Officer Liang. As I stated in my response I fear
this may be a tragic accident.
I greatly appreciate your comments and fully sympathize. And as I concluded
in my letter, I fear we both will be denied justice for the reasons you
enumerated.
Yours,
我的回复
Jeruvia, thank you so much for the understanding. My heart goes to Gurley's
family, and the Chinese community feels very sorry too. Some Black people
called this tragic accident a "modern day lynching", but we Chinese never
had any reason and intention to do that. Instead, we supported your civil
rights movement before, and now support your struggle for justice. Many
Black people don't realize that we are in the same boat, and we Chinese are
oppressed not less than you, such as in my case. Like you said, we both
will be denied justice. I believe this is not something Mr. Thomason did
alone. Whatever the outcome is, please let's not misunderstand each other. | J*******p
发帖数: 1129 | 2
is
赞！评论的很好！俺的也被pick了。
但是，你注意到吗？Among the 14 NYT picked comments, the one that got the
most thumb ups （156）from readers was based on false information
distributed by the media.
It goes like this: "According to information released by the prosecutor,
Officer Liag and his partner testified that immediately after the shooting,
they rendered no aid to Mr. Gurley. Rather, Officer Liang initially argued
about whether to call in the shooting and worried that he would be fired. He
then called his union rep. His failure to render aid figured into the
decision to charge him. The shooting may well have be an accident, but the
failure to immediate;y render aid to the man he had just shot was no
accident. No doubt in the shock of the moment the officer wasn't thinking
clearly, but it is telling that as Mr. Gurley literally lay dying, Officer
Liang's immediate thoughts were about the impact on his career and not on
the man he had just shot. Hard to see Officer Liang as a victim of
scapegoating here."
这一条comment 被NY Times 推荐，得到最多的thumb up，说明纽约时报还在歪曲事实
，而且误传和谎言还被许多人当作真的接受。事实是：梁在开枪后发text 已经证实并
不是真的。
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/12/peter-liang-akai-gurle
Fliedner, the lead prosecutor in the case, did not mention the order in
court Wednesday. He did say, however, that another report by the Daily News
-- which claimed Liang texted his union representative right after the
shooting -- was false.
这篇文章的comment 已关闭，急需大家给报纸写 Letter to Editor, 驳斥谎言！
【在 v*******e 的大作中提到】
: 【 以下文字转载自 Military 讨论区 】
: 发信人: fighter644 (武士), 信区: Military
: 标 题: 好消息，我挺梁警官的评论成了纽约时报编辑pick的评论了
: 发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Mon Feb 23 22:31:57 2015, 美东)
: 首先，祝贺大家的努力，华人的大签名活动以及各种抗议已经得到主流的注意，今天的
: 纽约时报发表文章专门说“梁警官事件华人社区分离的看法”，貌似很客观地报道了一
: 下华人的主流意见，而且允许评论。
: 400多评论，大多数认为梁警官是被当作了替罪羊。这不仅仅是我的观察，有人看了评
: 论也总结了：A lot of these comments are depressing with most viewing this
: situation through the lenses of whatever ethnic group they belong to with
| J*******p
发帖数: 1129 | 3
is
你文笔挺好，写信给NY Times 的编辑吧。我这几天实在没那么多时间。另一个资料：
PBA spokesperson, Albert O’Leary, said in an email to BuzzFeed News, “The
Daily News story about the officer texting a union delegate does not appear
to be true. We have over 400 delegates but the ones that serve the area he
was working in did not receive any texts from him.”
写给 [email protected]
/* */ 就可以。
【在 v*******e 的大作中提到】
: 【 以下文字转载自 Military 讨论区 】
: 发信人: fighter644 (武士), 信区: Military
: 标 题: 好消息，我挺梁警官的评论成了纽约时报编辑pick的评论了
: 发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Mon Feb 23 22:31:57 2015, 美东)
: 首先，祝贺大家的努力，华人的大签名活动以及各种抗议已经得到主流的注意，今天的
: 纽约时报发表文章专门说“梁警官事件华人社区分离的看法”，貌似很客观地报道了一
: 下华人的主流意见，而且允许评论。
: 400多评论，大多数认为梁警官是被当作了替罪羊。这不仅仅是我的观察，有人看了评
: 论也总结了：A lot of these comments are depressing with most viewing this
: situation through the lenses of whatever ethnic group they belong to with
| i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 4 黑人是不是死了？
黑人是否反击或袭警？
没有的话，就算这个警察没有刑责，出去之后也没法混了。搞不懂你们这些政客，为了
自己的评论，就随便挺，无罪出去后被撤职然后被报复的后果你承担？ | i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 5 好消息居然不是警官无罪，而是某人的评论上榜，可见目的不是救人，而是某些人自己
上榜罢了。 | v*******e
发帖数: 11604 | 6
如果没有楼主这样的人出头，毫无疑问警官入罪的可能性是非常大的。中国人都要起来
为我们的后代开创更好的生活环境。他的评论上榜，我们都高兴，乃是因为这样对警官
会有帮助。你这样的冷嘲热讽，是不对的。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 好消息居然不是警官无罪，而是某人的评论上榜，可见目的不是救人，而是某些人自己
: 上榜罢了。
| v*******e
发帖数: 11604 | 7 我们都是平时工作生活的所谓WSN，哪个是政客了？真的政客，是比如那发生案件第二
天就跳出来坚决要求起诉梁（司法独立哪里去了？）的外发女议员。这个警察没有刑责
的话，我们出去之后会混得更好，因为这说明我们得到公平对待。如果他入罪，中国人
才是没法混了，谁也不敢再当警察，成为美国最低等人种（其实现在就是）。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 黑人是不是死了？
: 黑人是否反击或袭警？
: 没有的话，就算这个警察没有刑责，出去之后也没法混了。搞不懂你们这些政客，为了
: 自己的评论，就随便挺，无罪出去后被撤职然后被报复的后果你承担？
| q********n
发帖数: 3248 | 8 支持楼主！文笔真好！
【在 v*******e 的大作中提到】
: 我们都是平时工作生活的所谓WSN，哪个是政客了？真的政客，是比如那发生案件第二
: 天就跳出来坚决要求起诉梁（司法独立哪里去了？）的外发女议员。这个警察没有刑责
: 的话，我们出去之后会混得更好，因为这说明我们得到公平对待。如果他入罪，中国人
: 才是没法混了，谁也不敢再当警察，成为美国最低等人种（其实现在就是）。
| u*****a
发帖数: 6276 | 9 http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/18/nyregion/officer-avoids-indic
武士所提的2004年白人警官打死黑人的案件，上面是连接。
1）该案，地方检察官也决定起诉开枪的白人警察，罪名是：criminally negligent
homicide and manslaughter ；貌似和梁警官的罪名很接近。2月11日，纽约布鲁克林
检察官肯尼斯·汤普森在大陪审团做出决定后宣布了对梁的起诉，指控他6项罪名：二
级过失杀人、刑事疏忽杀人、二级攻击、二级疏忽致险罪，及两项渎职罪
2）该案那个开枪的白人警官在大陪审团面前自己 testified 说自己当时害怕了，所以
不小心开了枪；他的搭档，Mr. Hallik，没有在大陪审团面前作证反驳开枪的被告的证
词。Mr. Hallik said the door flew open and he stumbled back.
Mr. Hallik has told investigators from the District Attorney’s Office that
his view was blocked in the crucial moment when Mr. Neri fired.
Mr. Neri, who screamed over his radio for an ambulance after the shooting,
reportedly said afterward that he had no memory of firing his weapon.
3）该案是房顶巡逻，按照当时的警察行为规范，可以举枪射击。
4）该案的大陪审团，其成员主要是黑人和墨西哥裔。
反过来看，梁警官没有 testify；他的搭档却做了对梁不利的证词。
这就是两个大陪审团得出不同结论的原因：他们相信警察的证词。
其次，梁警官当时在平民出入的楼道里，貌似按照目前的警察行为规范，不可以没有警
告，直接举枪射击。
回到2004年那个案子，按本版某种理论，那些当时支持白人警官无罪判决的黑人或墨西
哥人大陪审员，太TMD自恨了，当了搅屎棍，是白奸，无视自己族裔的权利，皮肤都漂
白了！
是这样的吗？
最后还是纳税人买单：The Stansbury family settled with the city for $2.1
million. The incident passed into history. | u*****a
发帖数: 6276 | 10 The death of Alberta Spruill: Spruill was a 57-year-old Harlem woman who
died in a flawed police raid in 2003. Spruill, a city employee for 29 years,
suffered a fatal heart attack after a dozen Emergency Service Unit officers
threw a flash grenade into her apartment. They had acted on bad information
from an informant that someone was using her apartment to store drugs and
guns.
In 2003, Ousmane Zongo, a newly arrived African immigrant was shot by police
officer Bryan Conroy during another bungled undercover raid — this one
aimed at a CD counterfeiting ring at a Chelsea warehouse. The cop, Conroy,
was isolated on the warehouse’s third floor, dressed in a mailman’s
uniform, where he confronted Zongo. The two apparently mistook each other
for robbers, leading to a chase through the warehouse’s maze-like rooms
that ended with Zongo’s death by a gun shot.
In September 2002, police had broken down the door of a Brooklyn woman,
Williemae Mack, with a similar explosive device, terrifying her and her 13-
year-old twin sons, jarred awake by the crash and boom. When one of the
twins hid under his bed, police pulled him out and put a gun to his head.
In October 2002, a retired housing cop, Richard Rogers, and his wife Marie,
a retired correction captain, were watching television in their Queens home
when cops broke down their door. Rogers grabbed his licensed gun and
prepared to shoot at what he assumed were intruders. Seeing the cops, he
dropped the gun and dove to cover it with his body so that they wouldn’t
shoot him, thinking he was going to fire at them.
In October 2002, NYPD police also broke down the door of Michael Thompson, a
licensed private nurse, and put a gun to his head. In each of these cases,
police had been searching for drugs and/or guns. In each case, their tips
were wrong. | | | k**n
发帖数: 6198 | 11 这个外发女议员应该得到我们community的鄙视.当初加州sca5的时候,先头出来放屁的
华裔议员后来怎么下场了,就是要让他们知道,你今天不需要base我们,终于有一天你会
因为不base我们可能失去你的议席.
中国人要坚持,要坚持
【在 v*******e 的大作中提到】
: 我们都是平时工作生活的所谓WSN，哪个是政客了？真的政客，是比如那发生案件第二
: 天就跳出来坚决要求起诉梁（司法独立哪里去了？）的外发女议员。这个警察没有刑责
: 的话，我们出去之后会混得更好，因为这说明我们得到公平对待。如果他入罪，中国人
: 才是没法混了，谁也不敢再当警察，成为美国最低等人种（其实现在就是）。
| u*****a
发帖数: 6276 | 12 武士在纽约时报写的回答的意思是说：黑人和华人都被白人欺负了，是在同一条船上的
战友。这是实话。
那些爱骂街的人没看见这句话吗？还是认为那个回话给武士短信支持其发言的“非常聪
明”的黑人，就是一个白痴！或者觉得武士在瞎说？
Quote:
. . .we supported your civil rights movement before, and now support your
struggle for justice. Many Black people don't realize that we are in the
same boat, and we Chinese are oppressed not less than you, such as in my
case. Like you said, we both will be denied justice. I believe this is not
something Mr. Thomason did alone. Whatever the outcome is, please let's not
misunderstand each other. | a*****r
发帖数: 1539 | 13 星岛电台广播说是手枪走火（梁警员是左撇子，右手拿着手电，左手拿枪开门的时候走
火），
子弹打到墙壁上反弹打到了那个黑人的胸口，黑人被打中后就从7楼往5楼走下去求救，梁
一度是不知道有打中人的。黑人是路人，不是嫌疑犯，也是不幸。
网上的英文报道不知道是不是真实情况。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 黑人是不是死了？
: 黑人是否反击或袭警？
: 没有的话，就算这个警察没有刑责，出去之后也没法混了。搞不懂你们这些政客，为了
: 自己的评论，就随便挺，无罪出去后被撤职然后被报复的后果你承担？
| i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 14 最好息事宁人，否则消息传出去大家都知道华人警察如此胆小走火，以后别的华人也没
法当警察了
另外政府赔受害人的钱，是否是你们辛苦纳税的钱？
，梁
【在 a*****r 的大作中提到】
: 星岛电台广播说是手枪走火（梁警员是左撇子，右手拿着手电，左手拿枪开门的时候走
: 火），
: 子弹打到墙壁上反弹打到了那个黑人的胸口，黑人被打中后就从7楼往5楼走下去求救，梁
: 一度是不知道有打中人的。黑人是路人，不是嫌疑犯，也是不幸。
: 网上的英文报道不知道是不是真实情况。
| a*****r
发帖数: 1539 | 15 你是怎么得出这个结论的“华人警察如此胆小走火”，
我的评论只是在讲述英文报道中没有提到的细节，
梁的子弹隔了一层打到那个不幸的死者，是一起概率很低的事件，
这你可以否认吗。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 最好息事宁人，否则消息传出去大家都知道华人警察如此胆小走火，以后别的华人也没
: 法当警察了
: 另外政府赔受害人的钱，是否是你们辛苦纳税的钱？
:
: ，梁
| i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 16 1 开火前看清对方了么？没看到就开火说明胆怯
2 开火后是否知道是自己的枪？说记不住了再次说明胆怯怕担责
3 开火前警告了对方否？
4 是否想过无辜被打死受害人的家属感受？大丈夫敢作敢当，为何只顾念自己老母？
【在 a*****r 的大作中提到】
: 你是怎么得出这个结论的“华人警察如此胆小走火”，
: 我的评论只是在讲述英文报道中没有提到的细节，
: 梁的子弹隔了一层打到那个不幸的死者，是一起概率很低的事件，
: 这你可以否认吗。
| a*****r
发帖数: 1539 | 17 楼道一片漆黑，都说是子弹打到墙壁上反弹到下一层射中了受害人，
为什么会事先警告对方？
自己看新闻去吧。
【在 i*****t 的大作中提到】
: 1 开火前看清对方了么？没看到就开火说明胆怯
: 2 开火后是否知道是自己的枪？说记不住了再次说明胆怯怕担责
: 3 开火前警告了对方否？
: 4 是否想过无辜被打死受害人的家属感受？大丈夫敢作敢当，为何只顾念自己老母？
| i*****t
发帖数: 24265 | 18 最好的方法就是拿出平时的英勇事迹给法官看，说明该警察经验丰富，立功多多。但是
仍然无法改变开枪事实，就算绊倒开枪也算开。所以不如多侧面报道些其人的事迹。
另外好奇华人警察对待华人是啥样的？是亲密，公正，还是更加严厉？
【在 a*****r 的大作中提到】
: 楼道一片漆黑，都说是子弹打到墙壁上反弹到下一层射中了受害人，
: 为什么会事先警告对方？
: 自己看新闻去吧。
| u*****a
发帖数: 6276 | 19 下回警察去居民楼，如果楼道漆黑的话，关他娘的，先哒哒哒放它一梭子枪过去壮胆。
结果这些地方，防弹背心都脱销了；而且大家在楼道里都匍匐前进。 | v*******e
发帖数: 11604 | 20 看你肖像和ID，就是个中国文人的死相，就是要和大家不一样。自比三国祢衡吧。
【在 u*****a 的大作中提到】
: 下回警察去居民楼，如果楼道漆黑的话，关他娘的，先哒哒哒放它一梭子枪过去壮胆。
: 结果这些地方，防弹背心都脱销了；而且大家在楼道里都匍匐前进。
|
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