T*R
发帖数: 36302 | 1 YAHOO刚辞职的CEO不就是伪造自己本科学历。除了辞职，屁事没有。
After lying about his computer science degree on his Yahoo resume CEO Scott
Thompson is said to be stepping down according to several sources close to
the decision.
AllThingsD says Yahoo will list Thompson’s resignation as quitting for “
personal reasons
Read more at http://www.inquisitr.com/235678/yahoo-ceo-scott-thompson-quitting-over-fake-resume-report/#eWQ8wtojptPhdcBP.99 |
C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 2 美国佬也不是神
不需要样样学美国佬吧
Scott
【在 T*R 的大作中提到】
: YAHOO刚辞职的CEO不就是伪造自己本科学历。除了辞职，屁事没有。
: After lying about his computer science degree on his Yahoo resume CEO Scott
: Thompson is said to be stepping down according to several sources close to
: the decision.
: AllThingsD says Yahoo will list Thompson’s resignation as quitting for “
: personal reasons
: Read more at http://www.inquisitr.com/235678/yahoo-ceo-scott-thompson-quitting-over-fake-resume-report/#eWQ8wtojptPhdcBP.99
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t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 3 其实方的那一套在北美根本行不通，也就国内的人好欺负
Scott
【在 T*R 的大作中提到】
: YAHOO刚辞职的CEO不就是伪造自己本科学历。除了辞职，屁事没有。
: After lying about his computer science degree on his Yahoo resume CEO Scott
: Thompson is said to be stepping down according to several sources close to
: the decision.
: AllThingsD says Yahoo will list Thompson’s resignation as quitting for “
: personal reasons
: Read more at http://www.inquisitr.com/235678/yahoo-ceo-scott-thompson-quitting-over-fake-resume-report/#eWQ8wtojptPhdcBP.99
|
T*R
发帖数: 36302 | 4 你不是说在其他国家都是诈骗罪吗？说的就是你。
要不要我再给你其他美国名人造假学历的物理证据？包括大学的。
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 美国佬也不是神
: 不需要样样学美国佬吧
:
: Scott
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C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 5 犯罪是写在书上
具体怎么样
那么多cases
哪里谈得完
【在 T*R 的大作中提到】
: 你不是说在其他国家都是诈骗罪吗？说的就是你。
: 要不要我再给你其他美国名人造假学历的物理证据？包括大学的。
|
t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 6 有没有犯罪,要判了才算,连这都不明白还谈什么法律
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 犯罪是写在书上
: 具体怎么样
: 那么多cases
: 哪里谈得完
|
w*p
发帖数: 16484 | 7 他这个是fake resume，富锦搞的是fake diploma，有点差别
Scott
【在 T*R 的大作中提到】
: YAHOO刚辞职的CEO不就是伪造自己本科学历。除了辞职，屁事没有。
: After lying about his computer science degree on his Yahoo resume CEO Scott
: Thompson is said to be stepping down according to several sources close to
: the decision.
: AllThingsD says Yahoo will list Thompson’s resignation as quitting for “
: personal reasons
: Read more at http://www.inquisitr.com/235678/yahoo-ceo-scott-thompson-quitting-over-fake-resume-report/#eWQ8wtojptPhdcBP.99
|
C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 8 行使伪造的历证书，即属犯罪
但某人是否犯罪，要convicted 或者pleaded guilty之后才算
如果 murder是犯罪
但murder之后，某人被抓，也只能说是嫌疑犯
虽然很多时候，证据早已确凿
【在 t*******3 的大作中提到】
: 有没有犯罪,要判了才算,连这都不明白还谈什么法律
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t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 9 1. What is "Forgery" under California Law?
In California, forgery is a type of fraud that is considered both a "white
collar" crime and a theft crime. Although most people think of forgery as
simply "signing someone else's name", the offense of forgery is actually
much more comprehensive.
Forgery occurs when you intend to commit a fraud and:
Sign someone else's name without authorization,
Counterfeit or recreate the seal or handwriting of another without prior
approval,
Alter, corrupt, or falsify specific legal written documents, such as a will
or court record, and/or
Falsely make, alter, recreate, counterfeit, utter, or publish
Any document or item relating to money, stocks, a sale, transfer, or
exchange of goods or property,
Any written document relating to how one intends to dispose of his/her
property upon death,
A legal document other than a will or court record (a power of attorney, for
example), or
A notarized document.
Just to clarify, the words "utter and publish" mean the same thing. They
mean to use or attempt to use an instrument or document either to (1) assert
that it is genuine, or (2) represent to someone else that it is genuine.
California forgery law only applies to acts that prejudice, damage, or
defraud another out of:
1.Money,
2.An interest in property, and/or
3.Other legal rights.3
2. How Does the Prosecutor Prove that I Committed Forgery Under Penal Code
470 PC?
In order to convict you under California forgery law, the prosecutor must
prove (1) that you engaged in one of the acts listed above, and (2) that you
did so with the specific intent to defraud.
As long as these two requirements are met, it doesn't matter
whether the person/entity you intended to defraud was actually defrauded,
or
whether you paid that person/entity back or attempted to make restitution
for your acts.
All that matters is that you had the intent to defraud when you committed
the act.4
What is "the intent to defraud"?
If you acted with the "intent to defraud", it means you intended to deceive
another person or entity for your own benefit at that person or entity's
expense. Making false statements or representations or intentionally
concealing or suppressing the truth will evidence this type of intent.
However, as previously mentioned, this deception must be aimed at depriving
someone else of a legal right or interest in order to benefit you. Simply
creating or altering a false document that has no legal significance won't
suffice.5
A variety of offenses are made illegal under California forgery law. Credit
card theft, government theft, and identity theft may all be prosecuted as
violating Penal Code 470.
Let me give you some examples to help illustrate what constitutes California
's general crime of forgery.
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 行使伪造的历证书，即属犯罪
: 但某人是否犯罪，要convicted 或者pleaded guilty之后才算
: 如果 murder是犯罪
: 但murder之后，某人被抓，也只能说是嫌疑犯
: 虽然很多时候，证据早已确凿
|
g****e
发帖数: 1829 | 10 He claimed he had a minor in computer science and was found out otherwise.
He was subsequently forced to resign. FuJin literally FORGE a certificate.
Its (usually) not a crime to lie about something; it's definitely a crime to
forge
document and gain advantage in favor. And this crime is called fraud.
Scott
【在 T*R 的大作中提到】
: YAHOO刚辞职的CEO不就是伪造自己本科学历。除了辞职，屁事没有。
: After lying about his computer science degree on his Yahoo resume CEO Scott
: Thompson is said to be stepping down according to several sources close to
: the decision.
: AllThingsD says Yahoo will list Thompson’s resignation as quitting for “
: personal reasons
: Read more at http://www.inquisitr.com/235678/yahoo-ceo-scott-thompson-quitting-over-fake-resume-report/#eWQ8wtojptPhdcBP.99
|
|
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C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 11 伪造学历，即属forgery
伪造学历谋取职称，属于fraud
此行为是crime，没错。
但执行此行为的当事人，要convicted以后才算罪犯。
和我说法一致。
will
【在 t*******3 的大作中提到】
: 1. What is "Forgery" under California Law?
: In California, forgery is a type of fraud that is considered both a "white
: collar" crime and a theft crime. Although most people think of forgery as
: simply "signing someone else's name", the offense of forgery is actually
: much more comprehensive.
: Forgery occurs when you intend to commit a fraud and:
: Sign someone else's name without authorization,
: Counterfeit or recreate the seal or handwriting of another without prior
: approval,
: Alter, corrupt, or falsify specific legal written documents, such as a will
|
t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 12 看这一条:
If you acted with the "intent to defraud", it means you intended to deceive
another person or entity for your own benefit at that person or entity's
expense.
===============================
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 伪造学历，即属forgery
: 伪造学历谋取职称，属于fraud
: 此行为是crime，没错。
: 但执行此行为的当事人，要convicted以后才算罪犯。
: 和我说法一致。
:
: will
|
C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 13 明显损害了厦门大学的利益、也损害了哥伦比亚大学的利益
还有可能损害了UCI的利益——因为有可能瞒着ＵＣＩ去厦门大学谋取 full time教职
（在我印象中，美国大部分的机构都不允许full time staff 去外面机构再受聘full
time staff）
deceive
【在 t*******3 的大作中提到】
: 看这一条:
: If you acted with the "intent to defraud", it means you intended to deceive
: another person or entity for your own benefit at that person or entity's
: expense.
: ===============================
|
t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 14 intend是意愿,全职半职要看具体的合同规定,你手头没有就不能断定什么
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 明显损害了厦门大学的利益、也损害了哥伦比亚大学的利益
: 还有可能损害了UCI的利益——因为有可能瞒着ＵＣＩ去厦门大学谋取 full time教职
: （在我印象中，美国大部分的机构都不允许full time staff 去外面机构再受聘full
: time staff）
:
: deceive
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C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 15 明显是intend to do so （故意）
难道还是过失ｃｌａｉｍ学历？
【在 t*******3 的大作中提到】
: intend是意愿,全职半职要看具体的合同规定,你手头没有就不能断定什么
|
t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 16 it means you intended to deceive
another person or entity for your own benefit at that person or entity's
expense.
===========================
没有要使厦大受损的意愿
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 明显是intend to do so （故意）
: 难道还是过失ｃｌａｉｍ学历？
|
C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 17 所以我说“可能损害了ＵＣＩ的利益”
但双边都是full time的证据很靠谱
厦门大学也说了，刚开始是part time，一年一个月
后来转成全职教授。而ＵＣＩ的工资表，１１年还在领取，也是ｆｕｌｌ ｔｉｍｅ的。
而美国一般机构是不允许full time staff到外面机构
特别是外国的机构再打full time 工的
但这些只是推测。不能１００％敲定。但我认为可能性挺高。
【在 t*******3 的大作中提到】
: intend是意愿,全职半职要看具体的合同规定,你手头没有就不能断定什么
|
C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 18 怎么可能？
明显“故意deceived了厦门大学 for 傅瑾's benefit, at厦门大学的expense”
【在 t*******3 的大作中提到】
: it means you intended to deceive
: another person or entity for your own benefit at that person or entity's
: expense.
: ===========================
: 没有要使厦大受损的意愿
|
t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 19 傅瑾在美国似乎还有项目不能真正全职回国,如果她和厦大订立的合同中对此有所说明,
就无可厚非.事实上他们实验室新招了一个Project Scientist估计就是准备接她的班的
.而且这和伪造学位证书无关.
的。
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 所以我说“可能损害了ＵＣＩ的利益”
: 但双边都是full time的证据很靠谱
: 厦门大学也说了，刚开始是part time，一年一个月
: 后来转成全职教授。而ＵＣＩ的工资表，１１年还在领取，也是ｆｕｌｌ ｔｉｍｅ的。
: 而美国一般机构是不允许full time staff到外面机构
: 特别是外国的机构再打full time 工的
: 但这些只是推测。不能１００％敲定。但我认为可能性挺高。
|
t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 20 只要合同本身对双方是公平的就不构成欺诈
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 怎么可能？
: 明显“故意deceived了厦门大学 for 傅瑾's benefit, at厦门大学的expense”
|
|
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C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 21 签的时候是公平的
现在就不一定了
我感觉你很糊涂啊
傅瑾水平高不代表这些做法没问题
【在 t*******3 的大作中提到】
: 只要合同本身对双方是公平的就不构成欺诈
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w******s
发帖数: 263 | 22 学历这个事还真得难说。就像空气中有杂质，人体中有各种有害细菌。但不能反比。 |
t*******3
发帖数: 2005 | 23 当然是看签的时候啊,因为讨论的是主观动机.她伪造证件当然有问题,可是够不够成犯
罪值得商榷.至于是否全职规定,要看三方的合同规定
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 签的时候是公平的
: 现在就不一定了
: 我感觉你很糊涂啊
: 傅瑾水平高不代表这些做法没问题
|
C****g
发帖数: 2220 | 24 难道她还是过失报错自己的学历的？
【在 t*******3 的大作中提到】
: 当然是看签的时候啊,因为讨论的是主观动机.她伪造证件当然有问题,可是够不够成犯
: 罪值得商榷.至于是否全职规定,要看三方的合同规定
|
g*q
发帖数: 26623 | 25 什么叫伪造学历?
Forgery的定义,是制造假文件,本身不一定算犯罪(比如造小孩玩的假钞).而把假文件当
真的使用确实是犯罪,至少在美国加拿大是这样.
在中国,刑法里也有伪造证件罪.不过如果没有"伪造公司、企业、事业单位、人民团体
的印章"好像就没事.
第二百七十九条 冒充国家机关工作人员招摇撞骗的，处三年以下有期徒刑、拘役
、管制或者剥夺政治权利；情节严重的，处三年以上十年以下有期徒刑。
冒充人民警察招摇撞骗的，依照前款的规定从重处罚。
第二百八十条 伪造、变造、买卖或者盗窃、抢夺、毁灭国家机关的公文、证件、
印章的，处三年以下有期徒刑、拘役、管制或者剥夺政治权利；情节严重的，处三年以
上十年以下有期徒刑。
伪造公司、企业、事业单位、人民团体的印章的，处三年以下有期徒刑、拘役、管
制或者剥夺政治权利。
伪造、变造居民身份证的，处三年以下有期徒刑、拘役、管制或者剥夺政治权利；
情节严重的，处三年以上七年以下有期徒刑。
第二百八十一条 非法生产、买卖人民警察制式服装、车辆号牌等专用标志、警械
，情节严重的，处三年以下有期徒刑、拘役或者管制，并处或者单处罚金。
单位犯前款罪的，对单位判处罚金，并对其直接负责的主管人员和其他直接责任人
员，依照前款的规定处罚。
【在 C****g 的大作中提到】
: 伪造学历，即属forgery
: 伪造学历谋取职称，属于fraud
: 此行为是crime，没错。
: 但执行此行为的当事人，要convicted以后才算罪犯。
: 和我说法一致。
:
: will
|
