k****u
发帖数: 133 | 1 俺不是大牛，:-)。以前不知道vaadin，刚看了几眼，不过之前用过GWT/gwt-ext/gxt和
flex，和这些RIA framework相比，vaadin最根本的区别就在于它是server side
framework，其它的都是client side framework。从这一点说，vaadin可谓是独辟蹊径
，避开了client side RIA framework面对的client/server数据传送的问题，也就是那
个臭名昭著的DTO pattern。这样的话，就大大简化了vaadin编程。其它的方面，UI
widget很丰富，图形界面设计也很专业，文档齐全，背后有商业公司运作。查了一下
wiki，MySQL的一个主要的初始开发牛人也投资了vaadin的公司。我也看好vaadin，多
谢mydaihao指点。 |
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k****u
发帖数: 133 | 2
Search Engine Optimization? That's a common problem to other RIA frameworks
as well, not just Vaadin. But GWT has some methods to mitigate this problem,
since Vaadin uses GWT for rendering, it should also apply to Vaadin. |
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m******o
发帖数: 774 | 3 本来在试Spring，这中间不知怎么跑到GWT去了，接着又看到vaadin。感觉vaadin非常
的有潜力啊，各位大牛意下如何？ |
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g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 4 vaadin looks like swing. For my past experience, swing is great to
achieve functionality. However, swing also has the problem. A professional
page designer usually is not a coder, it's hard to address that gap.
If you want a shiny webpage, vaadin may not be ideal.
If you want an destkop look&feel, it looks like a good choice. |
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m******t
发帖数: 2416 | 5 Vaadin looks cool. It brings GWT to the next level. I wish I had evaluated
it before starting this gwt-based
project I'm working on.
I do think though, it can be a double-edged sword that in vaadin the line
between server and client is sort of
blurred. It of course offers a cohesive and fluent paradigm, but at the same
time makes it harder to integrate
with other technologies. |
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m******o
发帖数: 774 | 6 I see. GWT still allows you to insert a piece of 'gwt' stuff into a html
file but vaadin does not do that now. If one day vaadin is smart enough to
interpret/combine a WYSIWYG generated html with its own then it would be
perfect I guess.
components |
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b*****t
发帖数: 1276 | 7 regarding the arguments of styling, whatever applies to Flex will apply to
Vaadin.
Also for styling it has two scope:
1. website (web page centric), goodbug arguments apply, designer can not do
whatever he/she thinks the best. he/she can only do some style of mix-in/
integrating.
2. web application (RIA), just make sure overall theme match. The detail UI
component layout usually determined by Product manager of that application.
From FAQ of Vaadin website, this is more for Web application than a |
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t*******e
发帖数: 684 | 8 Comparing the 3 web technologies, I have an interesting finding.
JSF has page layout, and component trees (in the form of JSF tags) both
declared in XHTML files.
Wicket maintains page layout in HTML, while component trees are defined in
Java classes. Component IDs in Java classes and the HTML placeholders have
to match.
Vaadin have both page layout and component trees defined in Java.
Obviously, Vaadin resembles SWING, in the sense that it is ajax event
driven, hides the HTML native code and req |
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m******t
发帖数: 2416 | 9
JPA是为
You could still implement the same "open in view" pattern
using vaadin's transaction listener. The difficulty lies in that it's hard
to tell which requests will eventually need database access, so you
might end up opening more sessions than necessary.
There are also some issues related to previously detached objects due to
vaadin passing objects across requests. |
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m******o
发帖数: 774 | 10 Set aside the question about which one creates better looking result, would
you agree that vaadin seems make web application development a lot easier
compare to any other ways available now? We've been doing jsp(java script)/
struts/EJB for years. Because we used have a whole team working on the jsp/
javascript/struts and now they are gone, now I really feel the pain to make
any changes to the UI because I used work on the EJB side. |
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m******o
发帖数: 774 | 11 Set aside the question about which one creates better looking result, would
you agree that vaadin seems make web application development a lot easier
compare to any other ways available now? We've been doing jsp(java script)/
struts/EJB for years. Because we used have a whole team working on the jsp/
javascript/struts and now they are gone, now I really feel the pain to make
any changes to the UI because I used work on the EJB side. |
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g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 12 Sure, I think it's a great product. Although I don't think EJB has
anything to do with Web UI layer.
There are 2 areas I would see as potential drawbacks of vaadin.
1. Very high throughput website. Apparently server side engine will
have to load a lot of stuff and keep it in session for this to work.
Compare to pure client side framework or traditional request-based
server side framework. Likely the memory footprint will be higher and
the number of current users will be lower.
2. Harder to achie |
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o**1
发帖数: 6383 | 13 very true for No. 1
for 2. Vaadin has CssLayout, which css can be used to style components.
But still, the separation of markup and content is not as good as Wicket.
easier
script)/
jsp/ |
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g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 14 vaadin looks more pojo than ZK, it's pure java, doesn't even use xml.
how can it not POJO?
For the declartive UI programming part, I think it can be supported
throught the framework too. Parsing a fixed format XML to make some API
calls shouldn't be very hard for them to do. Whether it's an advantage
though, might be case to case.
ZK is more similar to wicket. But until XUL is directly supported by
browsers. I'd prefer HTML as the UI language.
claims
toward.
still |
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g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 15 But you can take far less time to build Gmail with Vaadin,
that's the point. Gmail predates GWT. |
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m******o
发帖数: 774 | 16 Exactly, I'm not a UI guy at all so I'm quite uninformed about most of the frameworks
.I've been working with EJB's for the UI team but they are gone now and I have to fix all kinds of bugs even when they are in JSP's. I've hardly written a JSP by myself so you can imagine the frustration. Our product began 10 years ago, it has thousands of JSP's and their styles vary a lot. :o)
Regarding 2, if vaadin is based upon GWT and GWT allows a user-defined css file besides its default one, does that mea |
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g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 17 It's a bit difficult. A designer normally uses a WYSIWYG html editor
to get a shiny page. With traditional JSP/html template, it's easy
to preserve the look&feel since you are only making the values dynamic
(with a few css switch here and there).
With Vaadin, obviously the target html page is generated from the components
,
it's hard to match WYSIWYG editor.
frameworks
have to fix all kinds of bugs even when they are in JSP's. I've hardly
written a JSP by myself so you can imagine the frustrati |
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m******t
发帖数: 2416 | 18
how
GWT encourages css based styling, and from I read, so does vaadin.
So it may be easier than you imagine to have page designers working
in parallel with developers. |
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b*****t
发帖数: 1276 | 19 Yeah, if you have committed to use GWT, then there is no reason that you
should not use Vaadin.
same |
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g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 20 JSF is a disaster, neither coder friendly nor designer friendly.
I'd call it component model in Struts way.
Vaadin is exactly Swing. Coder friendly but not designer friendly.
But I can see it taking over once a rich
library is there. Building your own component is non-trivial, like
Swing.
Wicket is designer friendly but not as coder friendly. Easy to
create custom components. |
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o**1
发帖数: 6383 | 21 vaadin 点个 dropdown 什么的，都需要跑 server 一趟，这一点很不爽。 |
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t*******e
发帖数: 684 | 22 One concern is on the granularity of the database operations, more
specifically, updates. Secondly, those short lived Hibernate session
objects will lead to many detached entities, if they are ever cached.
Read-only access would be fine though. Let me finish my reading on
Vaadin, and come back to this discussion.
reasons.
still
user |
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t*******e
发帖数: 684 | 23 Vaadin的书没有提到persistence。有个wiki文章介绍了一下。基本上是EJB1/2里面的
value object(DTO) pattern，把detached entities当value object来用了。update
entity用merge()。实际上，persistent entity是自动synchronize database的。那个
TransactionListener就是个非常简单的filter,没什么大的帮助。Detached entitie都存在
Http Session里。还有就是Data Model API比较麻烦。对Hibernate的支持太弱了。个人感觉如
果整合seam page flow可能比较好。不过在此之前，对后台hibernate的applications, 真不好
用。 |
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t*******e
发帖数: 684 | 24 试了Vaadin, 回想起了7年前写Swing的经历, 折腾layout还是一样的繁. 准备硬着头皮
搞个template出来。感觉还是有HTML designer比较舒服. |
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m******t
发帖数: 2416 | 25 嗯，vaadin这个确实作得不好，render出来div太多，根本没法用css lay out。
当然你一旦接受这个事实，就可以闭上眼享受了。：） |
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s******e
发帖数: 493 | 26 Man, this thing is great.
if vaadin is based on gwt, should css layout be a problem? Did gwt solve
this problem incely already? |
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t*******e
发帖数: 684 | 27 I just try to get my hands wet. BTW, the address book tutorial seems more
useful than the vaadin book. |
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m******t
发帖数: 2416 | 28
Layout and styling problems mostly come from the components vaadin supplies,
like the table, or provides additional features on top of gwt's, like the
tree. |
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b******y
发帖数: 9224 | 29 Interesting, I haven't heard about it before. But, I think any attempt to
make the web more like a desktop is very tough, since the nature of the web
is based on http, and that's not a connection-oriented protocol.
So, I am not so sure about Vaadin. |
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t*******e
发帖数: 684 | 30 JavaFX team must be inspired your project :-)
I like a hierarchical UI definition, and hope Vaadin will take the same
approach eventually. |
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t*******e
发帖数: 684 | 31 公司graphic expert帮忙把Vaadin Layout里的spacing和margin搞清楚了, 他本人和我
都感觉很不错，相待好用. |
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q*********u
发帖数: 280 | 32 公司有一批老的html的layout，最近用了一下vaadin照着老的layout布局, 发现
customlayout用起来是比较方便，请教一下这个是不是用的越少越好？ |
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x****d
发帖数: 1766 | 33 for company internal project, without js developer, only java guys, we use
vaadin, or gwt with other stacks. vaadin client basically is gwt. but vaadin
based development is fast and easy.
for public access high traffic sites, we have to stick with jsf. Sometimes
spring mvc, but mostly jsf.
for public without high volume traffics, spring, struts or even vaadin all
good.
for GAE, we have to use light weight thing, now GAE supports spring
hibernate everything, but we still use plain servlet/jsp wit... 阅读全帖 |
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m********l
发帖数: 791 | 34 Thanks 好虫哥
Vaadin比SmartGWT的优势在哪里呢？没用过Vaadin。。
请问一下Vaadin有charting／dashboard功能吗？Invient Charts? |
|
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c*****a
发帖数: 1638 | 36 GWT其实不完全是给开发人员的。
因为google搞GWT的主要目的是为它自己的web application提供开发工具。google的开
发需求和多数公司不同（因为google基本上任何application都存在巨大的并发）。所以
建议你看一下：smartGWT，GXT或者vaadin。
我个人是非常喜欢vaadin，设计理念非常非常好，只是封装了太多，有点让我毛毛滴（
虽然是开源）。另外vaadin并不适用于超大量客户端数据的情况。 |
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J****r
发帖数: 274 | 37 绝对推荐vaadin！
vaadin的文档和community都搞的不错。基本上你需要的问题都能在网上找到答案。我
老用vaadin作presentation layer，基本上以一人之力，在10个月搞定一个产品，用户
对UI非常满意。
所以 |
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k***r
发帖数: 4260 | 38 老话题，呵呵
有些历史但是现在不时髦的的就先不说了，现在还火爆的里面，比较传统的
还算简单的有stripes。新一点的有component based wicket,
Echo 2/Echo 3, Vaadin。专门做RIA的ZK, Click，还有client
的framework GWT, Flex, 乱花渐欲迷人眼。
goodbug推崇wicket，版上还有几位推荐过ZK。偶目前对Vaadin比较感
兴趣。Echo 2/3的widgets十分强大，不过貌似比较笨重。ZK的widget
看上去不太好看，呵呵。
大家谈谈你用过的framework吧！ |
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g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 39 http://vaadin.com/book/-/page/components.table.html
It's pretty hard to beat vaadin. It's like programming
a swing table. No js, no configuration, no nothing.
Going through a mix of html, js and
server side Web services to get something like jQuery
running would be tough for a newbie. |
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r*****l
发帖数: 2859 | 40 Most, if not all, Java web framework are based on servlet API, part of the
Java EE standards. The standard war structure is like this:
root
- public folders
- WEB-INF
-- web.xml
-- private resources/folders
-- "lib" folder for (3rd party) libraries
-- "classes" folder for application classes
Anything under WEB-INF cannot be accessed directly.
web.xml is the entry point of dynamic contents. Servlet engine will look for
servlet mappings and map request URLs to appropriate servlets. Most
framework ... 阅读全帖 |
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g*****g
发帖数: 34805 | 41 I dont' know much about vaadin but if you are familar with swing
programming, there's some scrollable container to do that. I guess
vaadin is similar.
. |
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b*****p
发帖数: 9649 | 42 vaadin is based on GWT.
What the heck is Google doing here?
vaadin is far way much better than GWT. |
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x****d
发帖数: 1766 | 43 possible, if you use vaadin portlet, plus liferay portal server, your
development is pure java. I guess this is what LZ means. portlet itself as
concept is pure java as some said, jsr168 268, put in development you use
javascript and other stuff. with vaadin, you dont, you just use java.
I am not sure I am clear, but you would understand if you know about
webframeworks a bit. |
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o*****a
发帖数: 6401 | 44 HTTP Status 500 - com.vaadin.event.ListenerMethod$MethodException:
Invocation of method valueChange in com.shiphurry.app.ui.PagedTable$1 failed. |
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s******e
发帖数: 493 | 45 1.
swing for desktop apps. javafx for ria (kind of too late for the gamesupport
. dying like silverlight). on the other side, some server side gui techs
like jsf (swing at server side), gwt, vaadin , etc have their own markets
2. java was never designed for competing the speed with C++. it and its
extension (j2ee) with all powerful open source frameworks are for really
helpful for RAD (rapid application development), which is its cliche.
3. considering c# is native to windows, it might be a good... 阅读全帖 |
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x****d
发帖数: 1766 | 46 play is good if you are looking for scala support and rapid deploy for 练手
。If you want to try RIA and scala, have a look at vaadin. If you don't need
scala, then Grail, SpringMVC, Compojure.... you name it. |
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s******e
发帖数: 111 | 47 Java Developer (part-time)
A Media Technology Company is looking for a Java Developer to support our
established and dynamic team on a 3-6 month contract in New York, DC, or
Seattle. This role requires a sharp, driven, energetic, and polished
individual who is confident stepping in to an ongoing project to learn new
technology quickly and support quality development efficiently. We are
looking for someone who is familiar with: Java, Linux, Database and Web
Programming. The project will require... 阅读全帖 |
|
s******e
发帖数: 111 | 48 Java Developer (part-time)
A Media Technology Company is looking for a Java Developer to support our
established and dynamic team on a 3-6 month contract in New York, DC, or
Seattle. This role requires a sharp, driven, energetic, and polished
individual who is confident stepping in to an ongoing project to learn new
technology quickly and support quality development efficiently. We are
looking for someone who is familiar with: Java, Linux, Database and Web
Programming. The project will require... 阅读全帖 |
|
s******e
发帖数: 111 | 49 Java Developer (part-time)
A Media Technology Company is looking for a Java Developer to support our
established and dynamic team on a 3-6 month contract in New York, DC, or
Seattle. This role requires a sharp, driven, energetic, and polished
individual who is confident stepping in to an ongoing project to learn new
technology quickly and support quality development efficiently. We are
looking for someone who is familiar with: Java, Linux, Database and Web
Programming. The project will require... 阅读全帖 |
|
t********y
发帖数: 47 | 50 【 以下文字转载自 Java 讨论区 】
发信人: technology (技术), 信区: Java
标 题: jsp和j2ee什么关系？
发信站: BBS 未名空间站 (Tue Nov 15 22:47:26 2011, 美东)
做动态网站用什么？Servlet应该是直接用服务器的程序返回超文本吧？
对php有一定了解，jsp和php象吗？
另外，j2ee, ssh, gwt, vaadin都什么关系，和特点？编一个大概几个页面，包括上传
文件功能，用户管理的网站，用什么比较适合？谢谢 |
|
